The Customer Experience Podcast
The Customer Experience Podcast

Episode · 1 year ago

104. Differentiating Far Beyond Product, Features, or Price w/ Stacy Sherman

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

You need to acknowledge that employee experience (i.e. happiness) is a bridge to customer experience.

 

In this episode, I interview Stacy Sherman, the Head of Customer Experience & Employee Engagement at Schindler Elevator and the Founder at DoingCXRight, about the EX/CX intersection. 

 

Stacy and I chatted about:

 

- The role of video in EX and CX communication (one of my favorite topics)

 

- The heart and science approach to interest in CX

 

- Why Stacy spends nights and weekends on elevating the customer-centric culture 

 

Subscribe, listen, and rate/review the Customer Experience Podcast on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Google Play, or Google Podcasts, and find more episodes on our blog.

When your employees are really intentional andedit are happy. They then transferred to the customer. The customer sees itand feels it, especially the frontline. The single most important thing you cando today is to create and deliver a better experience for your customers. Learnhow sales, marketing and customer success experts create internal alignment, achieved desired outcomesand exceed customer expectations in a personal and human way. This is the customerexperience podcast. Here's your host, Ethan Butte. humanizing Your Business, indifferentiating your brand, in differentiating far beyond product features or price. That's themission of today's guest, and she's got a heart and science approach to doingit. Her background is in Account Management, ECOMMERCE, sales marketing and user experience, digital marketing and conversion optimization and related disciplines, with companies like atand t and verizon, as well as brands like Martha Stewart. An Americangirl, she currently serves as director of customer experience and employee engagement at SchinlElevator, where she manages and coaches team members in more than sixty field offices. She also coaches and consults and customer experience at doing CX Rightcom Stacy Sherman, welcome to the customer experience podcast. Hi, thank you. Yeah,I'm really excited about the story because in this conversation because of two things inparticular. One your experience in corporate America with very large organizations, as wellas your passion for doing this and doing some of it at night and onyour own time and things and helping other people in their businesses with it.So that's one. The other one, of course, is the bridge betweenemployee experience and customer experience, and I love that that's in your title andin one of your many roles and hats that you wear these days. SoI'm looking forward to getting into it, but will start where we always start, which is customer experience. When I say that to you, stacy,what does it mean? Yeah, so customer experience. Let me first bysaying that customer service is a very long time used word. Customer experience israther a new concept, or a methodology, I should say. So customer experienceis looking at the way customers and prospects go through interactions with a brand. So from the moment that a cut, that a prospect, a person learned, it becomes aware of your service or product to the experience of actuallybuying it and getting it set up and using and paying and getting help,and that get help is that customer service, right calling for help, and soit's really looking at designing the entire journey, setting those those experiences,validating them with customers, real customers, to make sure that their expectations aremet with what you designed. And then that's that's the big picture. Butthe key is that if the beginning, let's say how they learned and boughtand got set up, was great, seamless easy, but if getting helpwhen there's an issue is a high level of effort, that customers very likelygoing to leave and, even worse, they're going to tell others. Soto your question, it is much more than just customer service, which isabout the get help, an important phase of the journey. But people haveto look at the entire holistic view and that's customer experience. That was fantastic. There were a couple of things I really, really liked and I'll mentiona couple of them. First, as you talked about expectation management. It'sso important and that's one of the reasons that we need to look at everythingand make sure that it's all consistent,...

...because each touch sets up an expectation, hopefully a good one, and you need to continue to liver over andover and over at every one of these touch points. You also went straightyou just like straight out of the gates on that definition or your thoughts onhe went straight to the operationalization of it, which, you know, a lotof us that are not as we're not practitioners the same way that youare. Some of us aren't too who are in this community that I'm tryingto build around this, including myself, aren't students of it and practitioners ofit quite the same way that you are, and so I love that you wentstraight to the operational aspects of it, because I think that's so key andI hope to get into some really practical takeaways for those of us whoare, you know, aware that this is an emerging discipline, that itis there are nuances to it that is beyond customer service, customer support,even customer success, which in and of itself is kind of a practice andsome language for some things that have a foot in the past but also havea lot of new aspects to it too. so that's a fantastic go at customerexperience. You also do a lot with employee experience and employee engagement.So a couple things you could do here that would be really helpful. Oneis talk about employee engagement versus employee experience and or build a bridge from customerexperience to employee experience. Yes, so, just like I described the customer journey, there's also a journey for employees. So right from the moment they learnabout your brand and they become you know, the hiring process and theonboarding experience and then their first ninety days and so on. So it isthe leadership in these companies have to build out what's the best in class journeyfor the employees and what's that experience. Engagement is what happens when it's agood experience. So if, as a leader, which I'm very conscientious andintentionals, to make my team feel that they are valued, that the thattheir views matter, that they're empowered to do what's right for internal and externalcustomers, then they're more likely to be more engaged. And what I've studiedand have begun to approve with data is that when your custom when your employeesare really intentional and and they're happy, they then transferred to the customer.The customer sees it and feels it, especially the frontline. So that makessense absolutely. Yeah, they are the ones who deliver the experience to thecustomers for the most part, especially the customer facing rules, obviously, andI like the way you separated employee experience from Ploye engagement, that the engagementis the outcome of doing it. Well, let's tie kind of the first passin this last pass together a little bit. I feel like, justlike a lot of people maybe want to punt customer experience into a customer successor even customer service organization. My feeling, and you would know a lot betterthan I would, my feeling, is that a lot of people wantto punt employee experience and employee engagement into hr or talent management talk. Isthat what's happening in is that a mistake? Is that an okay place to start? Like, what do you think about that? Yeah, that's athat's a huge topic. I'll share my views, which is that you doneed a customer experience Cxo, a champion at the top. Right. Howwith that said, there has to be a very close partnership and collaboration withmarketing, with human resources, with operations, finance, with everybody, and drivethat drum beat and the best practices and helping everyone understand how they ownthe customer experience. It's not one person...

...or department, it's everyone. Ittakes a village, but you do need a champion at the top. Andthen when it comes to the HR topic, they're obviously the first in line tothe hiring customer centric people and it's important that they are mindful to hirepeople and ask the right questions to make sure you bring the right people inthat support the culture, the customer centric culture. When it comes to theVoice of employee, I call it Voe, which is some similar to voice ofcustomer voc you have to partner whether if HR owns that element of it, then it's just a close partnership. If this customer experience team owns thatelement, I think there's a lot of value to that, because then youcan really marry the voice of customer in the voice employee when you are decidingnew features, new products, new market messaging. I really believe you needto take both and marry it to come up with your business strategy. Ilove it at the at just the outset of your response there, when yousaid Cexos, like okay, this is good. Wouldn't it makes sense ifyou were to be in a position to assign someone to this, whether it'sa cxo or a similar title, to marry the X and CX functions?Yes, my opinion is yes, there are some companies. I'm learning,I'm actually studying a lot of different corporations. How are they structured? You know, I believe that HR has certainly a lot of human elements and benefitsand those things that keep you, you know, retention. But when itcomes to employee feedback as it relates to your business lines, that is ahuge responsibility that I do believe x and Cx have to come together. Andif, if that's not how your company is aligned, you still do itright, you still you the partner with them, or you do it andyou give everybody that feedback, but it's important. Or do you have anywe can do this one quickly because I know this would be an entire episodeon its own, but I just want to double back into VOC and Voe. I think most people who listen to a show like this would be familiarwith VOC voe. Is something they probably haven't heard as often. Could youjust do a quick drive by, if you were to, if you wereto do like a thirty minute consultation with a business leader who is, youknow, is aware of these ideas but not really intentionally practicing them, whatwould be you're just like really quick take on a few key measures around VOCwhich I think most people would be able to relate to. In what doyou do parallel to kind of capture voe? And I know that's a huge,huge question. So if you can have as much time at as atit as you want, but I would hate to miss the opportunity to getlike, you know, what are three or four collection points or measures orways to start paying attention to VOC Voe? Yes, so it's really important whena company, or department, let's say, is developing a new let'ssay a new product, or could be an existing product with a new feature. So the old way would be you would design it and you would goto market, throw it out and and hope it sticks, hope the customerswant it, and there that's all old news. Okay. And yes,and then you can get some customer feedback and surveys, and that's the oldway. The new way that you actually could con turn whatever your new productservice feature into a differentiator is starting with...

...the customer at the table and doconcept validation. Ask Them, right, you could have literally a piece ofpaper, it could be a sketch. What do you think about x?What's your view on all these value propositions, about x? Rank in order,what really resonates to you? And elaborate on those questions. And,by the way, if you had these features, what you're willingness to pay? Right. So there's all this prototype testing, concept validation with customers beforeyou even invested into this new big idea. And then you go through that agileprocess of development, and the key is to because I know a lotof product teams have deadlines and this is about quality over speed. But inthat whole phase that I just described, you also, and you do,get customers quantitative and qualitative feedback. You also go to your employees, tothe employees who are going to have to go sell and promote this new productor feature or service. So you ask them what about the solution makes senseto you, and you could actually ask them about maybe some of the trainingmaterial that you're putting together, what's missing, what's confusing. So you co createwith all the people all involved. The one caveat, and I can'tsay this strong enough, which is never replace the employee feedback instead of goingto customers. And I've seen companies do that where they'll take that shortcut andsay, well, let's just go to the salespeople and ask them instead ofasking the customer. And you really have to do both. You cannot replacea customer. A customers view so good. You have to wait collect it allway at all. And it's interesting. It's, you know, as Ithink about some of the customer feedback that we get, you know there'sthere's obviously a balance. I like the way you approach it, by theway you approach it from someplace different that I'm operating in my mind right now, which is, you know, you get customer feedback in a variety ofchannels and a variety of ways, whether it's cancelation feedback or support ticket feedbackor survey responses or, you know, unsolicited offers via email or social mediaor whatever, and it you have to weigh, you know, how importantis this voice versus that voice versus that voice, and I really love yourcaution here not to take three employees feedback for proxy for the you know,a fair proxy for the three hundred people they talked with in the past week, right, because it's filtered in its processed. I agree with you thatthe employee, the customers, voice is super important and specifically there's, let'sbring this a little bit into communication, something I've been really excited about inhandling a lot of direct customer feedback, which I choose to do a lotanytime we do surveys in those types of things. You know, we havepeople that are a little bit more hardcore than me from a quantitative view processingthe data, but I always volunteer to take the qualitative feedback and try toturn it into into meaningful things quantify to some degree because I love seeing thelanguage people use. It comes with like a weight and a character and thewords that they choose in these types of things. And so you already mentionedinternal communication with employees to make sure that they understand where we're going with thebig ideas and all of that, and that's that's one piece of communication.Where are some other internal and or external communication tips that you have in termsof making sure that everyone's on the same page and or that you're collecting theright stuff and some of the themes that...

...you've already spoken to. Yeah,so in terms of customer feedback, it is really, really important to definitelyask your customers the right questions and if you don't ask them the right questions, obviously you're not going to get the actionable feedback. You need to dosomething with it. So it's a science in an art in terms of thequestions, but also you have to close the loop and that means taking thatfeedback, and we're talking about the structured feedback for this moment, not nottalking about social media and ratings and reviews, because that's also feedback. That ispart of the puzzle that has to be has to putting that on ashelf for a moment because it is equally important, but taking the feedback andgetting it into your cells, your branch your sales offices, your product teams, you're marketing teams, so that they can actually understand what the customers sayingand then use that to drive their business decisions and also let the customer knowwhat you're actually doing because of their collective feedback and what happens is a lotof times, I know I've given feedback to companies and then I think it'sa sin, like some dark hole, like it never gets anywhere, andin customers need to have trust and belief that you're going to give feedback,you're going to do something with their feedback. Otherwise, don't waste their time.They'll actually become a detractor and unhappy because you wasted their time. Yeah, it's so interesting. I just did a two thousand seven hundred Mile Roadtrip with with our teenage son to visit several college campuses. One of themwas actually open for an in person tour, which I thought was pretty interesting,and they did a nice job of keeping us safe and distant from oneanother. But obviously I engage with a variety of brands and companies and II took care, just for fun, to fill out for feedback surveys kindof over the past week or so. It's that kind of came to meand what you're talking about is something I just immediately acutely feel. Is likesome of them were long and I just like would honor them. I justwalk them out and take the sub questions that open up after you give themlike you know they have hidden questions at all. So we're asking our customersto do so much, and I love your call here to close that loopand let them know what is happening, because the little thank you screen isn'tenough. A five dollar starbucks Gift Card is enough. Like I'm now somewhatemotionally invested. I would say the same thing for employees. Would you saythe same thing with regard to employees? Because something that we do at bombombis we do a twice annual all employee kind of survey. It's a littlebit like an employee nps at some level and there's plenty of open fields,and so what we do is a leadership team is kind of round up someof the feedback and then, if it's some of the loop closing is moreappropriate to an individual and some of the loop closing is more appropriate to adepartment or a team and some of it's a appropriate to the entire company.Do you have any thoughts or feedback on closing the loop with employees as well? Yeah, so. Well, I want to answer this from bridging thecustomer and the employee together. So what I see too often over the yearsis that we have a tendency to focus on the negative, and I'm encouraging. We talked about customer engagement, employee engagement before. This is how youdo it. When a customer especially calls out a particular name that really delightedthem and that they're grateful because Joe Schmo did, you know, went outof their way, you have to take that feedback and celebrate that person,thank them. We don't do that enough as human beings and focus on thewonderful human factors and and just always think...

...about what's wrong, what's where?Do we coach to be better? Yes, you need that, but you needeven more substantially to demonstrate what great looks like. So Voice of customer, they give feedback. I don't care what channel it is, online,offline. Make sure that the bosses are getting that feedback and they're taking thetime to acknowledge the great employees, because that's going to feed them to domore our excellence. I love it one of these. This brings me rightto something I was it really excited to talk to you about, among avariety of other topics, which is video. Something that we do this all thetime internally. And we teach people to do the same, which isyou know, and I've done this many times for myself, if I'm ina leadership meeting and I hear that a front if I hear a frontline employeesname from a midlevel or a senior manager and it kind of crosses my radar, I will vary. Often just make a note in like once a weekI'll go through these little notes that I have of people I want to thankor acknowledge or check in with or whatever and just hey, just want tolet you know, as in a meeting earlier this week and so and somentioned your name and the great work that you did with this thing. Ijust want to say I really, really appreciate you in the feedback I getby doing that. With a video is just through the roof. It likeit just it's so much different. What is your interest in video with regardto some of this customer communication or employee communication? Yeah, I'm a huge, huge proponent of video. I've been playing with the technology, including bombbomb, and I love it and the reason is because I know even formyself, my email inbox is so huge I can't possibly get to all ofit. Personal email work, email, text, you know, different communicationsflying at us all the time and so and I know people don't really read, but when you get a video as specially when it says one minute,thirty seconds whatever, it's like, okay, let me hear what they have tosay, and it grabs you right away. And so I've been playingwith that and testing it out and then responses are like even the family membersare like, I was having a bad day. Your video just absolutely brightenedme up and I'm like wow, you know, that was so easy,so quick. The feedback was phenomenal. So I think that I know thatvideo is here to stay. It is the future and what people need todo, because I'm speaking from experience, is to not be afraid of thetechnology. I think that gets in people's way to do something different. Sowhen companies like bombomb make it easy to actually use the technology, if that'sa low level of effort, there's a higher chance that people are going touse it and tell others. Yeah, I really appreciate that. I lovethat you're using it for personal effect as well. I mean it's just it'sit goes to something you said earlier and I forget the exact language but thisis kind of be a bridge to to another topic I want to talk aboutwith you, about your work and the way that you approach it. Butyou mentioned something about, you know, letting someone feel heard or letting someonefeel seen in, and it's that element. There's there's so many moments, whetherit's the the kind of internal leadership and management example I offered or thepersonal example that you mentioned, is just this taking this thought that I have, like, Oh, I need to see how she is or oh mygosh, I just heard this interesting piece of news about I'm going to reachout and congratulate and or thank him or whatever, making it into an action, but making you to do an action that people can feel that like that, that sincerity, that enthusiasm or that concern or that interest or those softerside elements that are really difficult just like type out and get through effectively.Yeah, I mean that's that's the beauty...

...of video, because you can't reallyconvey from the heart. You could feel it, you could feel the energywent through a video and I believe, especially during pandemics like this, thatwe need to find these creative ways to keep connection, to keep the feelingsand address the feelings even more sensitively, and that's that's what's going to change, I believe, the way we communicate, in the way we do business.I completely agree into the employee engagement side, to the degree that wecan equip and empower our team members to do the same like something that haskept me. I will have been a bomb nine years full time in September, which is just absolutely insane. It's twice as long as I've been anywhereand the thing that always brings me back and brings me to life is connectingwith customers and knowing that we're helping them or that they're getting real impact andin like when they feedback some of the stuff that you're doing in a positiveway and give you these little stories and moments. And so I know thatso many of our team members are highly, highly engaged because they have those sameinteractions with customers where they maybe send a video to follow up on asupport ticket and they get this reply back that says, oh my gosh,that's amazing. And so you start to see more first names showing up insome of these other feedback loops and feedback channels because they feel some attachment,not to the company or the brand, but to Jessica right, because Ifeel like I know Jessica down and she was so helpful to me anyway.So you mentioned in your response they're again, you know, you mentioned art andscience, you mentioned heart, you mentioned feeling a couple of times.Your approach to CX is a blend of heart and science and I love foryou just to speak to that because just in you know, we connected beforethis conversation. I've spent some time on your website and I love that you'reexplicit about it and I think it matters and I just be curious to hearabout it in your own words, like making sure to be explicit about heartand science. Yes, and, by the way, the customer service exampleyou gave before with that video. The reason why it works is it's sopersonalized. Right. There's no cookie cutter approaches anymore to any business. Themore personalize it is, the more that it stands out. So heart andscience to me is about so customer experience. There's definitely a method, all Gon how you do it and there's the basics and then there's some reallysophisticated techniques and platforms. So the science of it is a lot of thedata that comes from that methodical approach. And even when you think about thebasic level, if it's one on one customer interviews, if it's focus groups, if it's surveys, there is the element that you get numeric scores,so it becomes the scores and there's predictive predictability, modeling and future behaviors basedon the data you have. So's a lot of data analysis data scientists whoreally are doing so well in this field because it's needed and we know peopleare not just buying on price, they're buying on experiences. So there's ascience to it. But then there's the heart, because at the end ofthe day, a business is a business. We're buying from people who are inthe company and even some of my friends have said, Oh, myboss like I can't, I can't be here, and I'm like that's justa person, that's not the company is bad. It's just happens to bethat you have a disconnect with your boss. But you know and same thing ifyou have a bad experience with an employee, it's not the whole entirecompany is bad, but the reality is perception is reality and it does affectthe whole image, so that the heart...

...to it is really diving into thequalitative feedback and understanding what's said and what's not said. And it does allcome back to the sentiments and the feelings behind the numerics. So that's whythey're both really important. You can't make any judgments calls without both pieces.I love it, and one colors the other. Right. You can havesome of those qualitative feedback and it might drive some questions that you can getanswered through the data. Likewise, you can sit and pour over the data, but it's missing this context that even one little story from the qualitative sidewill completely change the way this report looks. Yes, absolutely so. Again,I mentioned this off the top, but you're obviously all in. Youare actively studying, you're doing it by day in a formal corporate role.You're doing it nights and, I assume, weekends for fun and interest, inpassion, doing some consulting, content development, etc. Where did in? You also acknowledged in the beginning that that there is something new about customerexperience as a discipline. So this is obviously not something that you were doing, at least under the label CX. You know, I've or ten yearsago, what was the kind of the dawn or spark or catalyst for yourobvious passion for customer experience? Like, where were you in your life foryour career? Where where something clicked in you're just like all in, orwas it a slow build? Yeah, that's a great question. So Ikind of have two answers in my mind. One is back in high school,long time ago. I won't I won't reveal how long ago. Therewas no Internet then and I was I remember I was in a marketing advertisingclass and we were studying consumer behaviors and actually was all about subliminal advertising andI was fascinated by subliminal ads and and they were probably magazines at the time, and what's the message say? And that what makes people move and andtake action, and I was fascinated and that pivoted me to go to collegeand I studied all marketing and consumer behaviors. So it's clearly in me to gothat path as opposed to accounting or engineering law. And then after collegeI ended up in a sales role at ATNT and continued on to get mymasters in marketing. And when I was finished with my masters, that's whenGoogle became Google and just the beginning of it and the world online. Infact, my thesis was what's the Internet? It's Hilarious to read it now,but and and so life goes on. Right. I went in and outof telecom and different industries and then about five maybe longer, two thousandand thirteen ish, I was at verizon. I was doing marketing at that timeand my boss said to me you're now going to do customer experience inthis BOC thing and as I as I call it, threw me a balland I'm and I'm like what is this thing? And he's like, Idon't know, go figure it out, and so I did. And thatwas really the beginning of how I start to really understand and that was ane commerce channel. So really understanding when traffic came, millions of people toverizoncom understanding, well, what's going to make them actually take out their creditcard and pay and making sure there's no friction along that customer buying journey.And so there was so much around the online digital experience turned it into Omnichannel, the buying online, pick up...

...a store, and so it evolvedand to the ants. To finalize the story is that when I got anopportunity where I am now at him Elevator Corporation, I had a decision tomake, which was do I want to continue down the path that I knewa long time, which was sales and digital marketing, or do I wantto continue down a career path really around CX customer experience, because the newrole Shin there was very much elevating the customer centric culture and bring new ideasto the organization as the CX leader, and so I want that path andthe beautiful thing is I we have a marketing department and and customer experience andwe work together. So it's a collaborative thing. It takes a village andI love this. I will. I am. I think the answer ofwhy I spend so much time on it is because it doesn't feel like work. So when you do what you love and love what you do doesn't feellike work. Yeah, what a healthy habit in I guess. So manyfollowed questions. I guess I'll start with what are you doing with doing CXright? Yes, so it started as a blog several years ago and Ireally encourage people to find their voice, whatever they're passionate about and just write, just just write, just get it out there. When I launched thisI had no idea if anyone would ever read anything I had to say.I thought maybe I'd be maybe my family and you're one. You do alot wrong quickly and then your two and three, it starts to really taketraction and you, you, you learned so much and now where I amnow is working on my dreams, which is writing books. I coauthored twobooks. One's out on kindle now and paper back in a few weeks andthen a second book coming in October. And mentoring people. I love.That's my favorite part, so that I could help people who either want toget into the field and don't know where to start or people who are expertsand want to take it to the next level. And I want to dosome Ted talks. I want to do I have a lot of a lotof dreams. So I'm adding them up. But but it's my own train rideright there's no speed. It's what comes naturally when I have my sparetime. I love it. I love that you're it was just such ahealthy hobby. is so wonderful and it's so naturally occurring. What a whatan awesome thing to be trusted enough by a supervisor to be thrown that ball. You know, and here we are years later and it all makes sensein hindsight. But you would have never seen it coming then. Not onlydidn't I see it coming then, but if that literally that ball, thatthat that symbolic ball, if that wasn't thrown to me and it was thrownto my neighbor, I wouldn't be sitting here today, I wouldn't have knownall the things I know and I wouldn't have gone for the certifications I did. I wouldn't have I wouldn't be here where I am now. So everythinghappens for a reason, I think. I know also that while I feltreally frustrated that that that boss threw me something and couldn't help me because hedidn't know, it made me tougher so that anything that comes my way nowI figure it out. It did then and now I can again. Soit's a good lesson. It's awesome and really that's a nice summary of lifein general. You know, you can either like duck and cover or justplay it safe, or you can just go figure it out when things comeyour way, and it's some cases we...

...don't have any other option. No, and I think the times were living and right now, where nobody canpredict anything. Right, like I'm sending my kids back to college in,you know, she very shortly, in days, and I don't know.Tomorrow the call can come. NOPE, no school or, you know,total change. So I think that's our new way of life of not knowing, being prepared to catch the balls and learning what to do with it.Yeah, and I hope that we in this. This is, I guess, not really related to the to the topic at hand necessarily, although itis in some way. This is the heart side of it. I hopethat in light of that, that that we can trust each other as teammembers and a customers and service and products suppliers, to just trust that everyoneis doing their best in light of the crazy situation. Give a little bitof space, give a little bit of patience, give a little bit ofgrace and, you know, just do our best together. I love thatyou said that and I want to do a quick recommendation for and there's noI have no incentive whatsoever to give this recommendation, but you just said,like everyone do their best. There's a book that changed my life called thefor agreements, and the fourth agreement is always do your best, and itsounds so simple, but each of the agreements don't assume anything, be impeccablewith your words, don't take anything personally and always do your best. Andeach one has a lot of meat behind each of those sections. And Ihad an epiphany actually a couple weeks ago. I wrote an article, it's inForbes now, about how this principle applies to business too, and soI encourage people to read the book and apply to their lives, because thenmore people will do their best, they will have more empathy and magic happens. I love it. They'll be better people and better team members and problembetter customers too. That's awesome. I'm so glad. I I entertain that, as sometimes I wonder in my own head like him, I taking thisoff course. That's awesome. I'm so glad. So, for folks whoare listening, we do short write ups on all of these episodes. Wetake video clips from these episodes to kind of so you can meet the guestsa little bit differently than just spending time in your ear buds with her.I also round up some links and so of course they'll be access to stacy'slinked in profile. Have doing CX right hooked up. I'll have the foragreements hooked up. I will I will find that article in forms and Hookthat thing up. And so if you're enjoying this podcast, of course youshould subscribe in your preferred player, but you can go an extra step byvisiting Bombombcomas podcast. In there you of course you can get what I offeredthere for every episode. In addition, you can check out other episodes.So like, if you like this one, here are a couple more that Ithink are on theme that you'll also enjoy episode seventy three with Christopher Wallace. He runs a consultancy called interview group, I nnar. So obviously it's internallyfocused and we called that one marketing to your employees, not just toyour customers, which we did a really nice drive by on earlier. Butthat's what his entire business is about. Is like rolling out big initiatives likein lot very large companies, and making sure that all the frontline people thatneed to execute it and deliver the experience don't just know what's going on,which I think is often taken for granted but also are cognitively and emotionally boughtinto it, so that it's a delivered with some level of excitement. Andsince Dirty Se's episode seventy three with Christopher Wallace and then episode eighty with GilCohen, we titled that one employee Experience Design how, why and where tobegin, and my conversation with him is one of the reasons I was soexcited to hear you separate employee engagement from employee experience with that was something thatwe talked about in that conversation as well, in designing an employee experience in orderto create a higher level of engagement...

...and then ultimately, of course,deliver a better experience for your customers as a consequence. So, Stacy,before I let you go, I need to ask you a couple more thingsthan I'll give you an opportunity to send people wherever you would like them toconnect with you, but first I always loved to know, and you dida nice shout out to the for agreements, but is there a person that youwould like to mention who's had a positive impact on your life or yourcareer? So many people, I would say, as a sort of mycareer, but as I entered the CX space. Who is I've mentioned hima lot, so if people have heard other shows, they'll they won't besurprised, but it's Chephiken. Great Dude, you know. You know shallow.Okay, so and and he's worth reinforcing again because he, as Isaid, he's he's famous. You know. No, no, no question aboutthat. He's famous and he never forgets where he came from and hehelps people like me, when I was first starting out to now, he'sthere. He's there for me, he's been a mentor, he's been sogiving of his time. He had me on a show and he he justgave me a voice and continues to do that. So that's my answer.I we need more ships in the world. That is awesome. Chef hike inHyka and he's hiking on twitter. He I agree. He's an awesomeguy. He has been on this show and you know, just to hearyou say that, that's a person who's obviously going about his life and hiswork in a way that is going to leave a very positive legacy. Mutualfriend of ours, Dan Ginghis, who I recently spoke with and who hasalso been on this show referred to him as the Godfather. Is like,well, of course he's The godfather of, like you know, customer he's oneof those people who did just a fantastic job of building that bridge fromcustomer service, as its traditionally been done, and broadening it out to to experiencein in which calls back to your definition of customer experience. Yeah,funny you mentioned Dan getting us because I was on his show yesterday and anothergreat good another great guy. And and the theme right that the invisible threadbetween those two guys and some others is that, and hopefully people will saythat about me on other people's podcast one day, and that is it's aboutshowing up authentically right this right now. There's no script, it's just comingfrom the heart and and that's what those two guys do and and many otherswomen see in Cx as well. That that's that's how you know, that'show you build trust and admiration and paying a forward. That's what it's about. I love it. That's also how you build a community and advance andmovement. In this case it's the movement to make customers experiences better. Speakingof which, can you think of a company or brand that you really appreciate, a respect for the experience that they deliver for you, stacy, asa customer. Yes, so again people are going to know this answer,but that's okay because I feel good about it. And that is trader Joe's. I love that. From the minute I walk in the door, peoplesay hello. So basic, right, but they say hello. They there'sa journey right when you walk into when you leave from the register and thenbagging your stuff, but they're talking to you and they're giving you recommendations aboutthe products. And when you walked in originally and you didn't know where somethingis, other markets, the the you know, someone in the staff willjust point to an aisle and you're guessing where is that? Where do theyjust point? Trader Joe's the walk you...

...to the actual product. They'll openthe bag and I'm like no, don't, don't waste it on me. Andlike no, no, it's okay, we want you to really like it, you know. So it's just filled with a lot of wow moments. That's that's my point. Love it. It's people who care and and itseems like the culture itself is probably pretty fun and I've seen trader Joe'son a number of lists that specifically treat their employees well, which just isa reinforcement of what you've shared with all of us here today, which isthat a great employee experience be gets a great customer experience. It's almost impossibleto produce a fantastic employee experience and not have a great customer experience as aconsequence. It's true and I am so excited. I'm going to be writingan article shortly. I interviewed some people at Trader Joe's and what it's likeand and so I obviously we talked about it. That's consumers, but I'mgoing to be writing about it from the inside. So awesome, be fun, great teas and if that happens to release, before I release this episode, I'll put that it won't bombomb thatcom slash podcast. Okay, cool,yeah, yeah, this has been awesome. I really enjoyed it so much.Again, there are several other places we could have gone, and soI'll have to have you back, but in the meantime, if people enjoyedthis, where would you send them to follow up and learn more and connectwith you and maybe read some of your articles and that type of thing.Yes, I welcome that at doing doianng C X, right Urghtcom, andit's filled with the resources and tools and tips and white papers on how youcan accelerate your skills and your practice, no matter where you worked, nomatter what industry you're in. I'm happy to help. Awesome doing CX,writecom. Check it out. Thank you so much for your time, stacy, and thank you for listening to the customer experience podcast. Clear Communication,human connection, higher conversion. These are just some of the benefits of addingvideo to the messages you're sending every day. It's easy to do with just alittle guidance, so pick up the official book rehumanize Your Business. Howpersonal videos accelerate sales and improve customer experience. Learn more in order today at BombombcomBook. That's bomb bombcom book. Thanks for listening to the customer experiencepodcast. Remember, the single most important thing you can do today is tocreate and deliver a better experience for your customers. Continue Learning the latest strategiesand tactics by subscribing right now in your favorite podcast player or visit Bombombcom podcast.

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