The Customer Experience Podcast
The Customer Experience Podcast

Episode · 3 months ago

164. Firing Your Villains & Leading with Vulnerability w/ Heather Monahan

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

Ignoring an antagonistic relationship at work is one of the worst things you can do — to yourself. Working with someone in a toxic situation can hinder your potential.

You need to learn how to fire your villain.

In this episode, I interview Heather Monahan, bestselling a uthor, renowned keynote speaker, and CEO at Boss in Heels LLC, about her story of creating confidence and overcoming villains. 

Join us as we discuss:

  • How Heather came to be fired from a job where she was successful
  • What it’s like to teach sales at Harvard
  • How to fire your villains 
  • How to provide value amidst changing markets and customers
  • What it means to set expectations for customer experience

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Fire your villain right if you havenegative people in your space, and get yourself away from them so you canset yourself up for to bring pods and people into your life. The singlemost important thing you can do today is to create and deliver a better experiencefor your customers. Learn how sales, marketing and customer success experts create internalalignment, achieved desired outcomes and exceed customer expectations in a personal and human way. This is the customer experience podcast. Here's your host, Ethan Butte.Today on the customer experience podcast we're hosting someone who's built a highly successful salescareer. She climbed the corporate ladder to become the chief revenue officer at anational broadcast media company, before getting fired despite doubling revenue to over two hundredbillion dollars a few years later. She's since become a best selling author,a text speaker and a Harvard Faculty member teaching professional sales and sales leadership.She was named a top forty female keynote speaker by real leaders. Last year. She was named the Girls Club thought leader of the year. Earlier thisyear she published her first book, Confidence Creator. In two thousand and eighteenand releasing next week, November. Two Thousand and twenty one is overcome yourvillains. Heather Monahan, welcome to the customer experience podcast. Thanks so muchfor having me. I am so excited to be here. Yeah, Ihope that folks found that introduction. For people who aren't familiar with you,I hope they on that introduction provocative and we will get to that story thatI tease right off the top of about how you made this massive transition inyour career. But before we get into that, I'd love to start wherewe always start here, which is customer experience. When I say that toyou, Heather, what does it mean? Customer experience means a customers perception overall process and interface with a brand, from post at the company creates toa website, to the process if they have a problem and need tocomplain to someone, to loving, you know, packaging. It's really fromthe moment they are they meet the brand, to you know, whatever happened today, love it. And so, in your in the earlier part ofyour career, before this this latest rebirth into something spectacular that you probably neverwould have seen for yourself ten years ago, necessarily your customers were advertisers. Iskind of a beob play. Who is your customer today? We gotthe various work that you do. Like, how do you think about that?Yeah, that's there isn't just one right. So for me I haveto look at the different business. So if I'm looking at my keynote speakingbusiness, it's primarily fortune five hundred companies, large companies, you know, anduniversities and and large events. But so that's one pocket, that isone interface and one customer that I deal with. Then I have customers ofmy books write the those seem to be different customers than there's customers from mypodcast, there's customers from my class when I'm teaching at Harvard. There's customersfor my consulting business. I mean there's so many different pockets that it's it'sa lot to keep up with. Yeah, I'll bet it is. Do youhave an organization behind you? Well, I have a team of people thatI work with, but no one that is like, you know,full time with me. Seven I am not there yet, but we arehoping that is happening later on this year. Awesome. We're going to dive intothe book in a minute. But you just did a quick drive byand I mentioned in the introduction I would love to know more about your engagementwith Harvard. I did read the story in the book about how that cametogether. But talk a little bit about specifically your engagement, but then alsothis idea, which I think is new to some people. I've met severalprofessors and programs that are starting to teach sales in an academic setting, likeprofessional sales and sales leadership. So talk about either side of that, likehow did you get engaged, how are you engaging with students and what doyou think in general, at a high level about teaching sales and sales leadershipin an academic setting? Yeah, so...

I could have never gotten into Harvardas a student. So I create a lot of content on social media specificallyLinkedin, and I had created a post something about how to open doors upin sales or something around sales, and a professor from Harvard who taught aclass and sales and sales leadership saw it and he dn me and just said, Hey, I'd love it if you could come teach a class, asyou know, just to step in and just be a guest professor for aday. So I took that opportunity did it. I loved it and Iwas really eye opening for me to see incredibly intelligent people and students. However, they didn't have a lot of real life experience, right. So Ihave a lot of real life experience around sales and sales leadership, so Iwas able to bring a lot of value. classmen great. And then fast forwardto a year later, he came back to me and said I'm ableto bring a second professor on to teach the course with me. Would youlike to apply to do it? And so I did and we taught togetherthis year, the first semester in two thousand and twenty one, and itwas great. There it. It's an interesting diverse group of students because alot of them are out working, some of them are have taken a yearup right. It's a really interesting group of people. Everyone's at different placesin their life but they all value that idea. I want to understand sales, I want to understand the sales process, I want to understand how to bebetter at sales and potentially get into a leadership roll. So it's definitelya much needed course. Love it and would you like just thinking about onyour own sales career, thinking back on maybe some of the people you hiredor maybe some of the people that you worked for before you took such ahigh leadership position. Who Do you think today is right for academic sales?I mean that because they're there a couple of schools of thought. One ofthem is like a little bit more kind of hustle culture. You got tolearn it in the streets, you got to learn it that way. Obviouslythere's also a viable path where this fills in some gaps and helps people likewho do you think an academic setting is good for versus go out there andlearn it the hard way? I guess everybody's different. For me, I'msomeone I need to go out and learn, learn things the hard I like beingimmersed and things like taking action. That's just my personality. I willsay a lot of the students that I've been working with at Harvard they're not. They're very different than me right so I think that you have to kindof have some self awareness. That am I willing to go with just immersemyself in this, or is that that feels too uncomfortable for me? I'mprobably not going to actually do it. You know, I'm someone who's goingto learn more in an academic situation. So I just I think you shouldjust be selfaware, ask yourself those questions and go with what you know makessense for you and your schedule. Really good advice. So you mentioned oneof the words. It's in the subtitle and it's part of your beak system. The book is overcome your villains, mastering your beliefs, actions and knowledgeto conquer any adversity. Just a quick note for listeners. I had theprivilege of reading the book. It wasn't released at the time and in fact, if you're listening to this immediate to release. You can preorder it now, but it's not available for release for another week, and I found tobe just as rich collection of stories organized around this beak beliefs, actions knowledgesystem. It was punctuated throughout with practical lessons, takeaway summaries. Very approachableread and, by the way, just to fund note the final acknowledgements.Your amazing add at the end there about hey, if you feel a particularway about not being included in the acknowledge bits. I was like, it'slike, exactly right. It's so funny that's an inside joking. Need toget the book, I think. To get it unless you want to seesomething about that, Heather. But there's an obvious villain in the beginning ofthis story, but obviously the book is not about that. That was kindof a trigger moment for you, so feel free to share that story alittle bit. I teased it in the introduction. But then speak to someof the other villains that challenge us in our roles as business professionals. Yeah, so for me, I came up in the media industry, started asan account executive and made it up to a chief revenue officer. I hadbeen promoted three times, I had just been named most influential woman and radioin two thousand and seventeen and then the...

CEO I work for became ill anddecided to replace himself with his daughter, who was my art nemesis throughout theentire time working there, and so she fired me immediately, and that wasreally in that moment that woman thought she fired me. I had just firedmy number one villain from my life and what I realized is that when you'reworking with someone in a toxic situation, when it's negative vibes and negativity,you're blocking yourself from bringing positive people into your life. So that day shethought she fired me, I actually fired her and suddenly really positive, amazingpeople started showing up in my life and I had this epiphany that I hadbeen ignoring something that was actually blocking me from my potential. Yes, so, I mean Gosh, what an interesting in weird dynamic. Even an organizationthat large and that successful personal dynamics at that level could create such weird change. It's a give it like just go back into that experience. I meandescribers a nemesis for for people that are maybe working alongside someone that they don'thave a constructive relationship up to that point where she had the power to makethis decision on your behalf, which turned out to be a benefit or ablessing, or however anyone wants to think about that or what language they wantto use. How did you manage that relationship, you know, for someonethat's maybe stuck in that situation that you were in four years before she hadthe ability to fire you? How did you manage that relationship, considering itwas so antagonistic? I mean it really bothered me tremendously, so much soI ended up throwing out my back, I started losing my hair right Iwould try to ignore it, which is the wrong approach, and hopes thatshe would go away and just say, Oh, I'm you know, I'mnot getting anything back from Heather, I'm just going to move on. Butin fact the opposite happened. She grew stronger in me ignoring her, andI grew weaker. I became a brate version of myself. I wasn't aspowerful, I didn't stand up and speak my mind as much because I wantedher not to notice me anymore. I wanted to disappear. So I reallycontributed to this really awful situation at work. And you know what I learned fromit since is that never or dim your light, never turn down whoyou are and hopes it's going to make somebody else feel better. It doesn'twork that way. In fact, that works the opposite way. The moreyou show up as a powerful version of yourself, the more you'll inspire otherpeople to show up as they are, real powerful versions of themselves. Soyou know, hat could I go back and do it differently? I certainlywould not have ignored the situation. I would have rather had direct conversations aroundit and say let's address this and you know, how are we going tofigure it out and move forward, because this isn't working. Yeah, Ilike. So the villain at some level is yourself. And you know,some of the other villains in there were like lack of confidence, fear,perfectionism. And you know what we do a bomb of course, make iteasy to record and send video messages and a wide variety of channels, andthese things get in the way of that too. When you're speaking to aroom of people specific to these themes, because I'm sure, like you've beenin a wide variety of rooms and audiences and videos and podcasts in all this, when you're speaking specifically to people on the themes of like building your confidence, overcoming your fear or discomfort, vulnerability or kind of setting perfectionism to theside, because it's just so you know, we think we're doing the best thingfor ourselves, but it's actually so crippling. What are some words ofadvice you would given in if you want to even speak specifically to someone whojust isn't confident enough or comfortable enough or overly perfectionistic to even a peer ina video message to one or two or three people like just hear some wordsof advice around these kind of underlying villains. Yeah, so the first thing Iwould say around creating confidence is number one. Fire your villain, right. If you have negative people in your space, get yourself away from themso you can set yourself up for to bring positive people into your life.Another thing I would say is start acknowledging...

...who are you following on social media, who are you spending time with, and start writing down. You know, I just left lunch with these ladies. I don't feel so good. Iwalked in feeling like be aware of how, when you spend time andenergy and exchange energy with people, how do you walk away from that?Is it benefiting you or is it harming you? And as you start toI do that through journaling and I recommend others you can just put notes downin a calendar. Does it matters? Just so you can go back andreflect on your day and your week and say, wow, I felt terribleTuesday. That's the day I work from home. I'm not doing well whenI'm isolated all day. Right, you'll start to understand what your different villainsare. You know, I'm following these people on social media. I feelterrible when I see their post. So start firing those situations that are hinderingyou and taking you backwards and start putting yourself around people and situations and things. And sometimes it's your job. You know, there's plenty of people outthere. I'm an accountant, but my real passion is drawing and art andworking with kids. Well, how maybe you can't put today, but howcan we start taking baby steps to get you working more at night, onon the weekends, building a business around Your Life Passion? Because the moreyou start moving yourself to those things that are really innately calling to you,the more you start showing up as a real version of you, the moreyou can start letting go of things like perfectionism, that we're never real tobegin with. But you were creating as controls in your life because you're reallyunhappy with different things that you were doing. Yes, that makes me think aboutthis kind of some people feel differently about it. I think I knowwhere you stand, but I feel like asking it anyway for clarity. Youknow, some people say you need to identify your weaknesses and really work toovercome those and like fill in those deficits and kind of thing. Other peopleare more on the other end, which is identify your strengths and really playto your strengths and just you know you can overcome your weaknesses, maybe bybringing in a partner or hiring to it or that kind of a thing.I feel like you're probably the latter, but speak to that just as kindof a common background theme when we're thinking about personal and professional development. Ohyeah, listen, everybody has flaws, right, and I like to rockmy flaws because it allows people to relate to you and see that you're areal person. I always talk about I have smelly feet and people think that'sthe funniest thing in the world, but I know that if I'm giving akeynote and I lead with that story, people have said this lady's a realdeal. I can relate to that. Right, they might not have smellyfeet, but they've got something they don't like about themselves. However, Idon't spend my time all day long sitting around fixating on what's not perfect aboutme or great about me. No, I spend my time saying, wow, I love being on stage. How can I find ways to get myselfon more stages. How can I find ways to get myself doing the thingsI love to do? I can't stand accounting in taxes. I hire anaccountant right. I'm not good at those things. I don't sit around andbeat myself up about why can't I be more organized and be like these otherpeople? Know, I go ahead and send it off to the people whoare great at it and let them tablet. So I encourage people to do that. Focus on the things and be proud of the things that you're greatat and that you love doing and spend more time doing those things and lesstime doing the things that you're not great up. Y's so interesting the waythose are intertwined. It really absolutely is a perfectionist thing to to imagine thatwe can take care of all of our weaknesses so that we are at somelevel perfect. Quote from the book. Slightly separate topic. This one's frompage one O seven. Not that you know it's on page one o seven. I've written a couple books. It's always funny when people go like reallyspecifically to appointment. That's that's a tough one. But but the quote isthis and there's a there's a key phrase in there that I really like that. I'd love for you to speak to when pitching yourself, put yourself intheir shoes and be sure to add value, and I think we all here addvalue. But this put yourself in their shoes, I think, isa step that so many people overlook in that choice of words. What doyou mean? Oh Gosh, I'll just give an example. So I waspitching myself for a job that didn't exist back this is a long time ago, when I saw an opportunity in a company and I knew, you knowthis, they needed to create this job. However, I thought if I approachit from how I see it and...

...from my shoes, it's not goingto land right. So I thought about the man I was pitching and Ithought to myself, okay, he doesn't like change, he's afraid of beinghaving to work hard, he's afraid of being exposed as not working hard.I thought about all the things that matter to him. Those things didn't matterto me that I could care less that they weren't concerns of mine. Butas I wrote down all of his concerns and how he would see the potentialchallenges with it, then I was able to come up with solutions for eachone. So when I pitched him my concept, an idea, which wasreally out of left field and, you know, a big ass, Iwas able to say, before you say anything, I want to cover someconcerns I think you may have, and then I was able to address everysingle one of the concerns he had. At the end he said, wow, this is a great idea. It's so funny how I'm certain, whenpeople are listening, that they're going to yeah, of course, what like, why wouldn't we do that? But we don't. We so often why? It just feel like we get so busy, busy, busy, thatwe're like, what do I need to say, what do I need toask for, what do I want, what do I need? And wejust like rush through all the stuff without taking that extra step of putting yourselfin their shoes, putting it into their language, speaking specifically to their needs, and it just goes so far. We call that human centered communication,and it's this idea of stopping being a little bit more conscious, a littlebit more intentional, thinking first about what's in it for the other person andwhen you approaches its cliche as heck to say, but like that, thatis where you create the win win or the win, win win, likeyour whole basis. It sounds like in that story heather is, I knowwhat I want out of this, but what's in it for this person?Let's break that all down and and you're essentially selling them their own wind.And when you start approaching things that way, you will get more wins. It'sIT works. Yeah, here's another one. It's a longer one,and so just react to it. However, you prefer never rely on one revenuestream, one form of customer acquisition or one means of delivering your productor service. Constantly challenge yourself to innovate how you monetize Your Business, acquirenew customers and solve problems for your client base. Change in uncertainty will beour constants, but we can always find our certainty within ourselves. Oh,I like that one. Ha, ha, ha ha. That's why I likelike I could have pulled a bunch of these quotes. I promised Idon't have. I don't have any more of them, but you're at thecenter of it. Everything around who is going to be changing all the time. Competitions changing, markets changing, customers are changing. Guys, love thisreminder and I just love you to kind of expound on it however you wish. Well, this the first story that popsince my mind is that I havebuilt a very strong presence on Linkedin. Ninety percent of my inbound leads formy keynotes speeches come from linked that not from agents. They come to medirect from Lincoln Linkedin. So this is a huge value to me. Right, this is my number one revenue sources. Linkedin thing. Guess what, Idon't own it. Right. So, and I wasn't thinking this way.I these are my own fails that I like to share so people canlearn from them, and I I'm learning from him too. This is mynumber one client acquisition location and all of a sudden one day I had myaccount shut down. I was put in linked in jail and I had noidea what I did wrong. I had no idea how to get out ofjail, but all of a sudden my business disappeared, even overnight. Right, I can't. I don't have any more client acquisition coming on because Iwas gone. So the panic that I put myself through and the upset becauseI needed to what I should have done had I thought about this ahead oftime and I hope everyone listening to things about this find a way to ownthat community. Not I'm renting it from some from linkedin right. So Ishould have been constantly working on every day acquiring the email addresses of every singleor text phone numbers. Are some way that I have a personal connection outsideof Linkedin to communicate with those individuals and not rely on Linkedin. And sothat was a big lesson for me that I learned. Last year I endedup getting out of linked in jail. It ended up that I had anassistant that was not in the same state as me logging in and they flaggedthe account and said you're out. So it was something I didn't even knowI was doing wrong. I wasn't trying to be malicious. Caused me amassive problem and from that day I've learned...

...we can it's just like the coronavirus, right. You know we don't want just brick and mortar stores. Weknow we need to have digital with support. We need to keep trying different waysand different to access products and services and or challenging ourselves to say,what other products and services can I create that can add more value? Yeah, speak just really quickly to the Sir in Te within ourselves. Like whatis how do we look just practically, how do we anchor into ourselves sothat we're firm amidst all this change, that we have some reasonable base tooperate from? Is Everything around us is kind of moving or changing or shifting. Like look at the end of that, which is this again really strong statement. I enjoyed it. We can always find our certainty within ourselves.You know, one of the things that I do is I look back onreally low moments in my life, like I look back on two thousand andeight, two thousand and nine and leading a company through a recession when wehad to let go of one fourth of our staff and I took the massivepay cut. I can remember those days and I had a one year oldson and I remember those day saying how am I going to pay my mortgage? How am I going to get out of this? I figured it outright, and so what? Now, when I look back to nine,I see that as a major win because I all I saw was darkness.So I've started and there's so many other situations like that in my life thatI can and now coronavirus as one right so I keep looking at these reallylow moments as really high points for me, and I hope our listeners right nowcan think of it that same way. Write down those challenges that you overcamp come and start to say, wait a minute, that's proof thatI can get through the next one, and just because I don't know what'sgoing to happen doesn't mean it's actually going to be bad. Sometimes it endsup being so much better than I ever expected. Why wouldn't this situation bethe exact same way? Yeah, you use that word expectation, which isexactly where I wanted to go next, which is, you know, ChapterTwenty Four. The title is the importance of setting expectations in the context here'sfor a meeting, for a task or other events in our life and ourcareer or even in our work. In setting expectations is a benefit to ourselvesand to others. I think so much disappointment, whether it's within ourselves orwhether it's customer disappointment or employee disappointment and then disengagement, is just a failyou're to set and manage expectations where I'd love for you to just share alittle bit of advice around that, because I think setting and managing customer expectationsand ideally exceeding them periodically, is key to an exceptional customer experience. SoI'd love you to share a little bit on how you set expectations for yourselfand or for customers. The most important thing, and any time I'm givinga keynote, I have this call with the client and I specifically say,tell me exactly how you want the audience walking away feeling and what do youwant them leaving with? And you wouldn't. You'd be surprised even how many answersI get that are so different than what I expect. But it's soimportant to ask that clarity question because you I have meetings with these people andthey're telling me I want to cover this and I want to cover this,but none of that really matters because the end, I know they only reallycare about the feedback they're going to get from the audience. Right. SoI'll some people. I did a Santandair Bank last week and they said wewant three tactical strategies that the team can implement in the next thirty days.It's going to help them elevate their business presence. Oh, okay, that'seasy, now that I'm crystal clear on that's what you want. However,they had never actually articulate that in any of the meetings that multiple meetings wehad had. Right. So it's so important that you ask that very direct, very point of question and I'd also challenge you to put it back tothem and writing, and that's how I close the loop on things with clients. Is, I say, great call today. Wanted to go ahead andreiterate what I heard you say to ensure that we're both on the same page. Your key goal for this call is, you know, and I lay itout again, just to get back the confirmation, because sometimes we thinkwe hear something and we might not hear what they're actually intending. So smart, it's like. Again, this seems so simple, but I think somany people drive by it every single day. I think we mistake communication for havingsaid approximately the right thing. Maybe...

...it approximately the right time to approximatelythe right people, but that's just saying things like communication is what the otherpeople, or other person here's an understands and then, as a consequence,expects. And so this idea of asking that clarifying question and then reiterating itback is such a misstep. I think we could avoid so much confusion andfrustration and wasted time and energy in our lives just taking the extra step toclose the loop. Absolutely it makes a big difference. I don't know howto ask this question in particular, but it's around a large I mean youbuild a highly successful sales career as a woman, which shouldn't be a thing, but it is. You told a story of not in great detail,but you told a story of sexual harassment in the book. It's obviously aproblem today. Hopefully it's less of a problem today than it was twenty yearsago. Your Girls Club thought leader of the year. We are very involvedwith girls club here at bombomb. Lauren Bailey, of course, has beena guest on this show and is a friend of the company. She's featuredin our new book Human Center Communication and what they're trying to do. Forfolks who are listening that aren't familiar with girls club and Lauren Bailey, they'retrying to change the face of sales leadership by empowering women and informing women andgiving women confidence to step into opportunities that they have absolutely deserved. But fora variety of reasons, perfectionism among them and some of these other things thedoors aren't quite open. I would love for you to share advice that maybeyou wish you had as a young woman going into the sales industry. Orwe can broaden it out and say, you know, revenue positions inside businessesgenerally speaking, like what have you learned? What do you wish you knew?What are some surprising pitfalls? What are some sadly highly expected and andpresent pitfalls? Like what have you learned along that journey? And yet Iguess I did form it kind of into a question. Yeah, you know, the the first thing I think of when I think back to being earlyin my twenties and getting into business is, I would you selfdeprecating humor, thinkingit was getting people to like me. EPIC fail. Do not do thatthat. You are always teaching people how to treat you. So,if you're walking around saying, blond Joe, I'm being addicts, ha ha,ha ha, I'm so I'm not always the smartest in the room,you are teaching people to say those things about you. So and even thoughyou might be nervous and that's your default socially, challenge yourself to find anew default saying nothing right. Be Calm and think. Say I need amoment, please write. Really try to be thoughtful about this, because youwant people walk away saying she's bright, she's talented, this girl's going places. Well, then you need to start speaking about yourself in that same regard, and I'm not saying to make up stories or gloat about yourself, butwhen people ask you how's your day going, my day is going fantastic. Ihad seven calls today. Not all our closes yet, but you know, in the pipeline here you want to be able to speak about your businessand speak about the value that you're bringing in a positive way. Don't diminishyourself. Yeah, in like inclusion. I'm going back a little bit todiscomfort, feeling unwelcoming. We use the word inclusion, whether it's in ourcustomer base or certainly within our employee community and employee groups. The best companiesthat are going to attract and retain the best people are inclusive environments and safetyand welcoming and inclusion or part of that. Do you have any advice for womenor for anyone else who's made to feel uncomfortable will by others words andactions. When it's coming at you like the you. What you just providedwas really good advice about casting yourself in a certain light for yourself and forother people and not diminishing yourself. But when it's coming at you, whetherit's like blatant sexual harassment or whether it's just discomfort or offhand remarks or otherthings that are kind of coming at you,...

...what advice do you have for peoplethat aren't in a welcoming and inclusive environment address it? The worst thingyou can do is bury your head in the sand, and I say thathaving done that for years myself. I was roasted at a work event whenI was named VP of sales and a her horrific way, and I didn'tknow what to do. I wanted to fight back the tears, so Istarted laughing, and the all that did was encourage that they hate or putit was essentially saying to people, please come do this more to me.You know, she thinks it's funny. I didn't think it was funny.I didn't know how to say this is inappropriate or just walk out and sayI'm not going to stand for someone speaking like this. That's what I shouldhave done. I either should have stood up and said this is inappropriate,stops now. Or if I couldn't have brought myself to that, I shouldhave just walked out of that event and said I'm not turning back because thisis ridiculous and completely inappropriate. So, no matter what, you have todo, remove yourself from the situation or stand up and speak up and followup on it. Yeah, I think probably a lot of people feel likeI am a support. They would never say these things consciously to themselves,but I'm a subordinate I don't have a right to do that, but ityou know, throughout, I mean, this is about overcoming your villains.It's about taking control over what you were going to accept in what you're notgoing to accept, and we certainly wouldn't blame a victim in this situation,but we wouldn't want someone to be victimized who has more control than she orhe might think that they do. So true, you've already reference Linkedin asa great source and thank you for sharing the fail story as a great sourceof business for you. Your highly present and prolific online for folks that wantto build a personal brand. But even in the context maybe of the businessthat they're working and they're not necessarily looking to be like you, specifically,Heather, in building a brand around yourself, but maybe they just want to bemore present, they want to be more active. I know it's kindof like a real general question, but what advice do you have for someonewho is maybe a little bit on the sidelines in terms of social whether it'sLinkedin or other platforms, that feels like they can and should do more?They maybe want to participate, they maybe might recognize that it would be goodbecause they might have opportunities come their way by being present, just like you're, harvord teaching thing. Did Great Story to there, by the way,for somebody's a little bit on the sidelines for whatever reason, or to thedegree that you're talking to people who are on the sidelines looking to get active, what are the common barriers that people are putting in front of themselves andwhat's a little bit of guidance that you might provide for people who want tostep it up and be a little bit more present and successful in social isopposed to just going out and talking at people? Yeah, what I woulddo is, number one, you need to hold yourself accountable, because ifyou can just push past this unfamiliar, uncomfortable moment that you're having. You'llpush through it. I felt the same way when I first started doing it. Find someone to hold you accountable, whether you develop a team of peoplethat you work with, you and say, guys, were let's do a thirtyday challenge. Everyone US going to post every single day, we're goingto meet once a week. Write hold your self accountable to whatever your goalis. Being consistent is everything showing up every single day. So break itdown to just a month and say I'm committing to do this for one month, I'm getting these people to do it with me and we're going to challengeon another. We're going to hold each other accountable or we're going to makeit happen and, you know what, I'm going to make mistakes and it'snot going to be perfect, and that's not the goal. Write down whatyour goal is. My goal is to show up every single day for thirtydays on this you know, on this platform. My goal is to whateveryour goals are, to get to new contacts or, you know, abusiness opportunity from this. Write down your goals, track your progress and staycommitted to it and you'll see even in a month you can get major progress. I have a woman that I've worked with for the past six months,I think, and she has post now there have hundreds of thousands of viewsand she's selling products on there and she was new to Linkedin, you know, not too long ago. So it doesn't take that long to develop acommunity and get some interaction have some wins. Yeah, consistency. I guess whenI ask for that type of advice...

...from a wide variety of accomplished people, consistency seem to be a very consistent theme among them. Either you,the primary listener to the show, is a sales, marketing or customer successleader or practitioner. What didn't we cover today? As you go out intothe world, as you share your stories, as you learn stories on your own, as you interact online, what are a few things that you mightshare with with someone who is either leading or managing a team or participating ina team with the hope of leading or managing it in a revenue function?What are some themes that are going on out there right now, like alike a new opportunity or something that you that you like to share with peoplethat really turns lights on or lights people's eyes up. Lead with Vulnera building. The more that you lead as the vulnerable version of you, the morepeople are going to be attracted towards you and the more you're going to attractthe right people. So often I see in business, especially in a zoomworld that we're in, people want to act as a different version of themselvesor they don't want to say, wow, this is a really tough time.I'm sick of being on zoom and I was hopeful that we'd be backto normal right open up. People always say, Oh, we have agreat company with a lot of trust and open door policy. What does thatreally mean? Start actually being the leader that shows up being vulneral. I'mhaving a tough time right now with this. I want to open up the floor. Is anyone else out there struggling right you want to create trust andhonesty and you want open communication, you need to be the one to leadwith it. So often people say my doors open, but no one respondsto that. Today, you need to be the one leading with the vulnerabilityand then watch how it comes back to you. I love it modeling thebehavior we want to see, modeling the behavior that we want to be standardin our culture. So much good advice here, so many really good stories, Heather, and for folks who enjoyed this conversation, this book is loadedand I had did not read your first book, I assume that it's probablysimilar, loaded with fantastic stories that are then punctuated with takeaways, assignments,things you can do. This conversation was exactly what I thought it and hopedit would be. For folks who enjoyed this one, I've got two morethan I know you'll also enjoy. Morgan J Ingram was on pretty recently.That's episode one hundred and fifty two. He is also, like Heather,highly accomplished on Linkedin. He's a three time linkedin. He might be afour time by the time this releases, a four time linkedin top sales voice. He is a video prospecting master, he's a sales trainer and our conversationwith him in that episode was about creating an environment of continuous coaching and soa lot of these themes that you talked about, heather, of investing inyourself or echoed in that conversation that yes, you can hope to get good leadershipand good management. In the position that you're in, hope to getgood guidance, but ultimately it's your own responsibility and you have the power totake control over those things. That's episode one hundred and fifty two with MorganJay Ingram, and of course I had to mention episode one hundred and fortynine with Lauren Bailey, founder of both factorate, a sales training organization,and Girls Club. We call that one a blissful approach to training customers andemployees. There's a lot about learning and development and growth in there. She'san expert trainer. Chuse to train corporate salespeople in very large settings for yearsbefore going out and doing her own thing, as you are successfully doing as well, Heather. Before I let you go, I've got two opportunities foryou, besides tell everyone where to follow up and how to get their handson overcome your villains and all of that. The first is to think or mentionedsomeone who's had a positive impact on your life for your career, whichI'm really excited about from you, because you're obviously a highly reflective person.And the other one is to give an or a shout out to a companyor brand that you appreciate for the experience that they deliver for you as acustomer. Yeah, I'd say from a business standpoint, one of my firstever mentors and business was Jeff Wilkes. He's made me an equity partner andmy early S. I'm so grateful for that opportunity. He allowed me toestablish a brand and a reputation in business and a very young age and taughtme so much about business and I'm just...

...super grateful than we stay friends tothis day and today. And the company that I would say that I reallyappreciate so much is gift Ology. I don't know if you've ever had JohnRuling on before. Have you had him? I haven't, but several units friendsand guests are. I've been gifted that book twice, okay, infact. A practitioner, you'll enjoy this one. For folks who are listening, we do put video clips up at bombombcom slash podcast. This gift,which is a laser cut white hydro flask with the podcasts on it, wasof the Gift Ology Philosophy from James Carberry at sweetish. Well, I lovethe gyptology philosophy. I think John's amazing. I had him as a guest onmy so you should definitely have him. He's really such a thoughtful, caringperson and the way he reframes the power of gifting, when done correctly, it really it's a game changer and I'm really grateful for Giftology and him. Awesome, really good recommendation, and you're right, I do need toreach out to him. It's one of those things, you know, likewhen you get a recommendation on a book and you're like, Oh, yeah, I should do that. It takes maybe the second or third person likeokay, about yeah, now I got to pull the trigger. Yeah,I really that. I have to. Like, I just feel so compelled. All these are people I like in respect and they all say the samething. I need to do it. Heather, this has been so fun. I enjoyed it. I so appreciate your openness. You're a very goodstoryteller and I think people really learn that way. I think for folks whoenjoyed this again, there are a couple of books that you can and shouldread, but I'll leave it to you. How there just to send people off, if they've enjoyed this conversation, how should they reach out? Howshould they connect with you, where they follow you. It's all if yougo to overcome your villainscom right now you can pre order the book and getthe five hundred dollar bonus bundled downloaded immediately and that it's going to disappear veryshortly, so please do that so you can get the video cores in thework books and all the stuff that goes with it. I'm so excited forto check it out. I'm at Heather Monahan on all social media. Awesome. We will linked that up at bombombcom slash podcast. She is Heather Monahan. I am Ethan viewed. I thank you so much for listening and Ihope you have an awesome rest of your day. The digital, virtual andonline spaces where we work every day are noisier and more polluted than ever,and the problem is only getting worse. At risk or relationships and Revenue JointBOMBOMBS, Steve Passanelli and Ethan Butt, along with eleven other experts in sales, marketing, customer experience, emotional intelligence, leadership and other disciplines, to learna new way to break through the noise and pollution human centered communication.A new book out now on Fast Company press. Learn more by visiting Bombombcombook or search human centered communication wherever you buy books. Thanks for listening tothe customer experience podcast. Remember the single most important thing you can do todayis to create and deliver a better experience for your customers. Continue Learning thelatest strategies and tactics by subscribing right now in your favorite podcast player or visitBombombcom podcasts.

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