The Customer Experience Podcast
The Customer Experience Podcast

Episode · 2 months ago

219. Sending Videos for Greater Sales Visibility w/ Viveka von Rosen


What you see on video is pretty much what you get. Video gives you a sense of who the person is. At present and in the future, salespeople need to become comfortable with video through the techniques of “created charisma”.

In this episode of our Human-Centered Communication expert series (which originally aired on September 21, 2021), Steve Pacinelli and I interview Viveka von Rosen, Co-Founder and Chief Visibility Officer (CVO) at Vengreso, about using video to create visibility in sales.

Join us as we discuss:

  • What the relationship between video and visibility is
  • Who video is and is not good for
  • Why video gets straight to the heart of authenticity
  • When to shift the script to create connection
  • What the role of LinkedIn is for salespeople

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The single most important thing you can do today is to create and deliver a better experience for your customers. Learn how sales, marketing and customer success experts create internal alignment, achieved desired outcomes and exceed customer expectations in a personal and human way. This is the customer experience podcast. Here's your host, Ethan Butte. She's a linkedin expert with a teacher's heart. She's CO founder, chief visibility officer and master trainer at Van Gresso, and she's featured in chapter ten of the Wall Street Journal Bestseller Human Centered Communication. This episode features Vivica von Rosen and it's co hosted with my longtime friend and team member, our CMO here at Bom bomb, and my co author on Human Centered Communication, Steve Passonelli, because I'm taking advantage of bomb bomb's sabbatical program right now. We're re racking some of the most popular episodes from last year's human centered communication series, including this conversation with Vivica. She shares with us the relationship between video and visibility, who video is and isn't good for, why video gets straight to the heart of authenticity, when to shift the script to create connection and what the best use of Linkedin is for salespeople. Now me, Steve and Vivica von Rosen. Today we have Vivica von Rosen, a k a super VIV CO founder of Dresso, chief visibility officer, which we're gonna get into that. We're gonna we have questions around that, that title, in that role. She's actually on the advisory board of one of our largest competitors, which is fun. But but we're cool with that and so is she. So this is awesome. Linkedin expert forbs top twenty most influential and again, like all of our previous guests in this series, just an awesome person overall. Welcome, VIC awesome and it's so great to be here. I love Bom bomb too, you do, and that's the thing. I that's a cool thing about the project is some people know bom bombs, some of them didn't really. I mean they knew us a little bit, but they didn't know a lot about our product. Um, it's not just about video messages. Some people use various people included in the book use our competitors, and so it's it's really all about how do we raise up awareness and proficiency around being effective communicating in more personal and human ways, but we'll be getting into that through the conversation. We definitely are going to talk a bit about video because that's something that you've taught hundreds, if not thousands, if not tens of thousands, of sales professionals over the years. So definitely be getting into that. But we're gonna start a pivicat where we always start on this show, which is customer experience. When I say customer experience, and what does that mean to you? You know, obviously the experience that customers have. But it's funny because we are transitioning in a U C S O. I'm C X O Rather, so, you know, a new customer success customer experience officer, and so I'm learning that customer experience is so much bigger than just the experience that our customers are having from you know what you need to do in the background, all the team members that you have to have, the scripts, the checklists, the technology, everything that needs to be in place so that when our customers come and experience our product, our service, whatever it is, that it seems seamless, that it seems intuitive, and yet you know it's it's that. It's that duck floating or that Swan floating on the water and underneath it's like Ah, and I'm just learning more and more about that as we as we on board our new C Xo. That's awesome. What a cool experience for everybody that that it's not just about...

...let's give someone that title, find the right person, plug him in and off we go. It sounds like it's something that and properly, the whole team is involved in. Well, you know, it's really shown us where our strengths are and where our weaknesses are, because our previous C Xo was Bernie Borges, who was a founder of the company. So he built the company with us, and so there's so much about van Gresso that's in our heads Um, but as the as the company has grown from Ford to, you know, forty, Um, we're, you know, in our heads. Is Not a good place for the company to be now. So that's what we really discovered, and bringing in this new person is, you know, what do we know and what do we know that needs to be put on paper? Essentially, what's your product or service OFFCA, tell us about it. Here's your ideal customer and what problem do you solve for them. Sure. Well, generically, Van Gresso helps Um salespeople, entrepreneurs individual business owners create more qualitified conversations on Linkedin. We help you prospect better and sell more. Specifically, we work mainly with beat enterprise, size B, two B sales teams through Linkedin, through sales navigator and through social video, which is why I'm so excited to be here. Um, too, still create more quality and qualified conversations to build their pipeline and sell more. Awesome. And now let's go to your title, because it's really an interesting one. I don't know that we've I know for a fact that we've never hosted a chief visibility officer on the show and I gotta say I don't know that I know any of them besides you. And so tell us a little bit of like what does visibility mean? Do you, in this context, kind of what does a successful day or Weeker, month or quarter look like as a chief visibility officer? And you like this multi part question. Maybe where does video fit into this, because obviously video enhances visibility. To just give us a run at at being a chief stability officer. Sure so, you know there's chief learning officer, which I could be because I'm the master trainer at Van Gresso. There's, you know, chief, our CMO was taken, our CSO was taken, even though I'm involved obviously in marketing and sales. Um, I did not want to be CEO. So, you know, thank you, Mario for being CEO. Um. But we were trying to figure out, like what what is? What qualifies me? What? What am I chief of at Van Gresso? I'm coming into the company. You know, I had a pretty decent reputation on social I had a big following, Um, I did a lot of speaking publicly and privately, and so I and I'd written a couple of books and I was a linkedin learning author. So I had that kind of visibility. Um. So we're like, well, okay, how about chief visibility officer, because it's certainly aligns with all my functions at Van Gresso, but it also speaks to, you know, kind of my status Um within van Gresso as well, and it's a literate of with my name. So, you know, Vivica van Gresso visibility. Yeah, that's great, and you teach other people how to increase their visibility exactly. And you know, video is a big Oh, video is also a literati of Vivica, Vengresso, visibility and video. It was meant to be, you know, but video truly is about creating that visibility and what we've been through during the pandemic, during covid is people not being visible with each other, at least at the beginning, before we got super comfortable with Zoom and teams and all of the other platforms out there, but it was, you know, we were so isolated and trying to do business in an isolated way and using linkedin because that was kind of our only way to network for a long time. And so the addition of video with us, specifically video within Linkedin, but social video, using, you know, zoom and and having those and turning on your camera and having those video meetings, be able to send video messages, video email obviously being an important part of...

...that, all helped to bring um a little bit more for one of a better word, a little bit more understanding, compassion, alignment between ourselves as sellers and our buyers out there, because there was just a huge gap for a while. So one of the things that Ethan and I do before, or have been doing and all of these interviews, is watching the previous interview back that we did for human centered communication and you know, when we watch it back, you know there's always things that pop in your head. Well, why didn't I ask that question at that particular time? And so one of the things that we just breathed by uh, that we thought was was interesting that we would like to expand upon right now is you mentioned video wasn't the best idea for for everyone, and we're like man, so we could in so many different ways. Is it? Is it roll specific? Are there sales people that shouldn't touch it? or or because you're in sales, you have to use video, and then like into the types of video for video messaging or video you're doing, and there's so many questions in there. Can you start walking us down that path of video isn't the best idea for everyone? Yeah, you know, there there are a few people. So first of all I would say video is awesome if you can get comfortable with it. Um, but a lot of people, and hopefully now that we've been on zoom and we've seen ourselves on cameras so much, we're a little bit more comfortable with it, there are some people who are never going to be comfortable with it when they do video, even if it's their tenth video, their hundredth video. It's awkward, it's stilted and it's not serving them for whatever reason. You know, it's like being on stage. Some people are just paralyzed being on stage. For whatever reason they just can't get past it. Now we found even the folks who are like, Nope, I don't want to do this. I can't believe you're making me do the selling with video course, like I I'm not gonna do it. Um. What we've taught them in how to use their voices, use their hands, verbal and non verbal, you know, engagement with their with their audience. Most of them get to the point where, okay, this is okay, Um, I can do it. I might not love it, I might not do it again after this course is completed, but but I can do it. And so I do think that most people, with the right kind of training or with enough practice, or you know by reading through the book and some of the things that Lauren shares, that that they will get their hands around and able to utilize video. Um. But there are those, there are those that it's really going to hurt their brand. They're just they're never going to get comfortable with it and then so don't do it. I mean stick to your written words, stick to your phone calls. We're able to have live meetings and now in most countries. So you know, go back to your live meetings there. You know that there are times when it's going to hurt them. There's other people out there who have built this brand like around who they are and what they look like and then when they go to video it's a completely different person. And for those folks I would say, you know, stick with whatever brand you had before, or slowly shift your brand. But when we go to thinking that you're twenty years younger, forty pounds lighter or whatever it is, and then you get on video and you're this completely different person, it's really jarring Um. So you know, in that case I'm like, let's just stick with your brand or slowly Moreph your brand into who you actually are right now, because that disconnect is huge and and I think it could negative, negatively impact your ability to sell. But for salespeople, let's just go sales people specifically, because there's a lot of...

...use cases for video for interdepartmental communication and product team members recording their screens and sharing that. I mean there's so and and, of course, you know you don't need to be that comfortable on video to convey a complex topic, you know, by sharing the screen. But for sales people specifically, is that almost like a prerequisite requisite to be in sales or to be a good salesperson, is to be comfortable with who you are and the ability to transfer emotion, like so, if someone is terrible at video, because the only reason we're asking this because Mario said, like we don't hire people that aren't comfortable on video, for for Vorzzo and so people, or they got to get comfortable real quick, like yeah, yeah, yeah, so is to be in sales? Is that a is that a mandatory requirement in your opinion or now and or just to add to that, is that where we're going? You know, if it wasn't before, because but but I by that question out right. I'm really curious what you have their VIVICA. Yeah, and I mean Mario and I might differ, and that's okay. So, UM, to Steve's point, I think there were a lot of people in sales who are comfortable in the real life, you know, engagement, but for whatever reason that camera just freaks them out and so they just can't get past that. They just can't get past that. Um or it's just technology, right, they just they there may be a little bit older, they're not used to like taking the one million and one selfies every ten seconds. They're just not comfortable with the technology and for whatever reason they can't get over it. Right. And there are some people, whether it's I mean whether it's female salespeople who just can't get over bad hair days, which I'm having right now. So ponytail Um or, you know, or being twenty pounds overweight, Um and then we can get into whole kinds of gender disparity, but maybe we shouldn't. Or other it's just the guy who just can't handle the technology. You know, he's always done his selling on the golf course, he's always done his selling on site visits. He's never done so. He doesn't even cold call, right. He's just he's always been that jovial dude who everybody knows and the big hugger and handshaker, but he just cannot handle the technology. So for those folks, I do think it's not everyone and it's probably, you know, a very small minority of most sales people, but they are absolutely out there and I don't want them to say, you know, just give up and retire because you're you know, you're not ever going to be able to sell again. That's that's just simply not true. Um, they can find ways around that. Um. But, Ethan, to your point, I think you know, the pandemic has shifted so much working from home. I mean, look at all everything that's blowing up right now about c e o s or like. We want our people back at work and the workers are like, yeah, no, we're gonna stay here. Um, the things have Chan changed and I do think that in the future sales people are going to have to get comfortable with video, and I love that Mario says we don't. We have certainly hired people who are not comfortable with video, but they get comfortable right, because we we force the force. We we make all of our people turn their cameras on during our meetings and since we're all over the world, it might be two o'clock of the morning, you know, we might have babies attached to our our hips, um, but but the camera comes on. Um. So it is something I think that for the future, especially if we continue doing this virtual selling that sales people are gonna have to get used to. Awesome. A couple of quick follow ups here, but for listeners we're talking about Mario Martinez, junior, CEO of Van Gresso. He has his episode in conversation with us, has already released in this series. So you can just go to bomb bomb dot com slash podcast and find that. And both Mario and VIVICA are featured in human centered communication and in the chapter that we that we...

...wrote around Mario's teachings and insights. We do talk a lot about internal culture. Some really good stuff there that you all are doing to help people get comfortable, to manage expectations and align people around the expectations. And in the last note here for listeners, Van Gresso was initiated and completely built as a completely remote workforce. Um, and so it was critical from the get go to get that foundation right. So, UM, follow up here to this idea of more people are going to need to get comfortable doing this in the future. You've taught all kinds of different people in all kinds of different industries how to get comfortable using video in social media, in messages, in emails, Etcetera. Kind of two part question, because everyone is going to say this isn't for me, I hate this, I'm uncomfortable right. So when we make this call where we truly accept she's not cut out for this, or I'm not cut out for this or he's not cut out for this, and I'm thinking maybe as a sales manager, which kind of leads to the other part of the question, which is how can a team prepare to make this transition into making video communication in general and video messages in particular, part of the way that they're successfully building relationships and accelerating pipeline? Yeah, you know, and we have. We've had we you know, we've worked with a lot of different verticals, different sized sales teams, Um, and you get your folks who are like I'm in you know, and they're so excited about it, and then you have the folks that are, you know, like yeah, you'll see my video for our final test and that's the only time you're going to see our video. So you you definitely get that push and pull a little bit. Um. For us, what has been absolutely key is that the leadership, the sales leadership, whether it's the sales manager, the you know, in some cases the CMO, the CSO Um, that the sales leadership also puts themselves out there and gets involved the the sales leaders who are learning along with their employer, with their employees. Um, are those those teams are by far the most successful because they're just like they're putting themselves out there and they're like I got you know, I got Zits, I've got I stumble, Um, I make mistakes. No one's perfect, and then the rest of the team goes okay, if he can do that or if she does that, then I can do it too. So that, for us, has been key, is getting the sales leadership involved with the training along with with all the other employees, along with all the other learners. Um, there are some people who just bless them, they just so challenged and they they tried really hard and they did all the you know, they did all the homework and they they they did all the videos they were supposed to and it's just super awkward. But in some cases what they came up with was cool. Um, someone on my team can do the video and I can just send the introduction so there can be another account manager say that does the DEO or the sales leader does the video and says, Hey, you know, this is sales leader, Blah, Blah Blah, I'm shooting this video for John, who you know really well. Um, he wanted to let you know. Blah, blah, blah, and so in. And that's not the best thing to do, but it's certainly a solution if you've got someone who just can't do it. Cool for the sake of asking the obvious. And Steve, I'm excited to go to where you're going to take us next. But one last question here, at at the risk of asking the obvious, what are you sharing with people at the beginning of say something like you're selling on video. Course, why we need to be using video? How is this different? How is this better than what we are doing today? I like, that's very obvious to me. It's very obvious to Steve, it's very obvious to you, but I guarantee someone listening is wondering like why, why would I even bother if I'm going to be uncomfortable? Why would I even bother to push through that discomfort? Well, you know, there's the Omni Omni channel, approach number one.

So if you've tried email, if you've tried cold calling. If you can't do site visits right now, you know, because maybe your state hasn't opened up. Um, if you don't have their phone numbers, so you can't text them, or you know their cell phone numbers, you can't text them. So you're you're kind of stuck on ways of engaging. Video adds another channel. And when you go from three to four channels, Um, you know, say a cold call and a video, email and voice mail, voice message, and then say a video using either linked in or an email, you know, bom bomb, email video, it increases the likelihood of someone responding to you like by four. So it's just, in one way, another channel, but it's a channel that's so different from what most people are doing out there. Like linked in. Inherently we prefer using UM tools like bomb bomb or the other one, where we can send a link and it's got a little thumbnail and the video will pop up. But you can, you can, using your linked in mobile device, send a video. Now how different is that from all the other spammy messages you're getting? There's also a voicemail too, but I recommend sending the video and and it and it does. It stands out Um, and it's that kalet factor that no like and trust factor. I can you know, I can read stuff all day long. I can see pretty, you know, face tuned pictures all day long. But but what right, but what you see on video, unless assume and it's got touched up your appearance. But what you see on video is pretty much what you get. And so you get the sense of who the person is. Now what we teach in our classes, you know, it's it's it's kind of created charisma. We teach both verbal and non verbal charisma, and so one mistake that people make is being a little bit too sedate. Um, you notice I'm now. I'm not saying everyone has to be Super Viv we talked about that a little bit. But there is this balance between who you normally are, laid back to lax, talking kind of monotone, and being wild and crazy. There's a there's a there's a balance between those and that's what comes across best on video, and that's when I that's what I'm saying. That's this kind of like created charisma. It teaches people to get to that next level so that when someone does see the video, Um, they are getting a sense of who the person is, even though you know a person who's doing the video might feel it's like a little over the top, it does give people actually a better sense of who is on the other side of the screen and who they're going to be engaging with. Oh that it's just like anything else. It's a balance between people want things to be a and B and it's usually not. There's a whole bunch of gray in between and you need to find, you know, the right balance between MENA too. Is there a correlation between anonymity, digital anonymity, and crappy messages? We were, we were, we were thinking about this, thinking about this before. Uh Ethan I met ahead of time and we go through questions and and it really came out. Let me let me give you a little bit of backstory and then you can answer the question. I love that you were just talking about the leaders getting in and doing it too, because guess what we just did? Ethan and I just responded to leads, leads coming into the system. You know, we get several thousand leads. Were thousand leads coming in and Ethan I took a chunk of those leads and started responding every day with video for a month and so we learned so much. But one of the things that that I learned, and not saying we have crappy messages, but sometimes, when I was prompted for email number seven in the fourteen day free trial, and I would reread it and...

...then I'm like, Oh, I got to actually say I don't know if I believe this message, like it's not good enough, because now it's associated with me as a person, it's who I am. I'm delivering it and if I would, if I didn't have to deliver, I would just hit the send button. You probably wouldn't even read it, you would just hit the send button because it's already been created. Yeah, yeah, hit the button. Yeah. So talk to us about, you know, about like being front and center and video and how that could bring out the best than your messaging because you pause, you're more intentional, you're more thoughtful. You know, I love that you said that because in our process we've got, you know, kind of templated scripts that are the baseline for what we then create for the client, and even in that process we're like wow, that's really Stilton, like, I never say that, right. And so even within our own scripts and this is what we do right, this is this is what we do, this is. Well, then Gressi would does even in our own scripts. We're like, okay, that, that was really stilted. And then we start working with the client and the clients like, okay, that's really stilted. We would say this instead. So then we have to morph the script some more. And then you get the individual learners who are then taking these scripts and making them their own and they're like, I would never say that. And so yeah, I mean there is, I think when we use sales scripts on the phone, when you certainly when use we use sales scripts and emails, a lot that we would normally never say probably gets past the monitors and goes out to our audience and then might come across as absolutely inauthentic. So I hadn't really thought about that before, but I do love that. Yeah, when you apply script plus me equals, that's not an authentic voice. Then then there is some you know, there does need to be some communication with marketing, with with, you know, sales enablement to how can we align who I really am, what I would really say Um to what's going out to my audience? And then, never mind, you know, we've got the buyer's journey, we've got all the different levels of buyer's journey, we've got all the different buyer personas. Am I going to have to shift that script depending on where my buyer is in the buyer's journey and who I'm speaking to in my buyer's journey? Yeah, really interesting. I mean there are two layers. There's one is is this this script and communication plan that's been prescribed to me? Does it feel like me and my and then how does my relation to Steve's question? How does my relationship change when I'm putting my own face and voice behind that message? How does that change it? But then this layer that you that you just added, which is everyone that you're sending it to, is a little bit different. Even if they fit these three criteria, they're completely unique individuals. Talk about how, Um, you teach in any of the courses that you've taught over the years or that you're actively teaching now. How do you balance because there is this you know, we talked with Mario, of course, a lot about art and science. I'm sure you have to Um, you know that the science of we need this repeatable process. We need script that we know work at this particular level and we need everyone to follow approximately the same things, that we know that our theories are holding and that what we're doing is true and we can iterate on that and make it better and better and better. At the same time, we want to give people some sense of creative freedom and ownership over the message, ownership over the relationship, and then when we're asking them to do video, we're asking them to take that the next later, deeper. How do you kind of teach that balance of the science, of of repeat process, uniform script, uniform messaging, versus you need to own it and put some real human spirit behind it and it needs to be uniquely your own? Yeah, yeah, absolutely. So you know, there are certainly cases where you're gonna be saying the same script over and over again, Um, in which case you know, you you...'re going to craft the script to speak to a buyer persona as opposed to an individual. So I know that. You know, if I'm talking to you know, CSOS who are women at enterprise sized companies, I might use this script. I might more fit a little bit differently for you know the CMO mail at SMB. So there's the scripts. Themselves shift a little bit depending on the buyer persona. And then, of course, there are use cases of where you would never use a script per se. I'm if I'm, you know, outlining, say, a proposal that I'm sending, uh, and so I'm just walking people through the proposal in a video. Um, that's not obviously going to be scripted. But there are still some things, Um, standards, I guess, that I want to make sure I cover, like, I don't want to go too long. Um, I want to make sure that I'm, you know, I'm getting to the points quickly. I want to make sure that I am still using the voice modulation in the hand gestures. I want to make sure that I'm speaking the person's name as well as writing the person's name and the message, you know. So there are some standards that, Um, I want to make sure I'm I'm checking off those boxes, but it really depends on the use case, who the WHO the person is on the other side and and how, I guess how important the message is. If I'm just responding to, you know, forty, fifty, sixty linkedin invitations a day, I maybe have two or three videos that I put you know that I that I shuffle between if I'm sending a proposal, Um, to someone I've just spent, you know, two and a half hours with on zoom, it's going to be a lot different type of a lot different type of video, although there are still things for all of them that I want to make. I want to make sure I have the right like I said, the right lighting, the right length, the right modulation, the right hand justure ers Um. Some of those things are going to be standard across all types of videos. In use cases, awesome. We would be completely remiss, of course, if we did not ask the linkedin expert. At least one linkedin question come up a little bit. But so this is a really interesting one. So in the episode that we released last week with Jacko Vander Koi, founder of winning by design. Uh, he introduced something that, Steve, was it new to you? Yeah, I was totally new to me too. I had never thought about this and I would love your take on it. So we were talking a little bit about the way people are doing business, why we need to be more human centered in our approach, the long term reputational damage, and what came up was the idea that a lot of B drs and SDRs are being asked. They're just basically being prescribed a playbook. You have to do these steps in this order with these typed out words, etcetera. They don't have much control over it. Some of it is maybe more aggressive or not as thoughtful, not as well targeted, some of these things that we all know are annoying and frustrating to receive. But they're being asked to do it from their own personal linked in profiles. So I never thought about the consequences of I'm using my own personal asset, which is a long term asset for me, and I know you know the value of it and can preach the value of it as well as anybody. Um, I'm being asked essentially to potentially denigrate the value of this long term asset that I hold personally for organizational benefit, now to my benefit in this role. Talk about that tension. Have you observed this before? Have you discussed this before? Like, what do you think about that? Like we're sales managers asking people to to do things that they would never do with their own linked in profile, and this kind of ties even too this question of I feel different about sending the message if my face and voice are on it. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly. Yeah, no, this this comes up all the time, in fact, so much so that it's one of the first things that we address when we do our onboarding, our our our kickoffs with our...

...clients. Because, yes, you know, the fact is you own your linkedin profile and no boss can tell you what to do with it. So quite. I mean, I guess they could fire you if you didn't, but according to Linkedin, you know, no one can make you do anything with your linkedin profile that you don't want to. Our response to that is absolutely don't ever do anything you're uncomfortable with, don't you know. Don't customize your about section or ad media that totally makes you uncomfortable. Don't adjust your settings to be more visible if you're afraid of stalking or whatever. I never want our clients to do anything that they're like, deeply uncomfortable with. Um. And that being said, having worked with now hundreds of thousands of people, run hundreds of thousands of people through our programs, we absolutely know what works on Linkedin, especially as far as profiles, engagement, messaging, etcetera, and so we are sharing best practices. You know, we highly recommend you elevate your brand because you're co branding with your company. When you leave the company, by all means take the company's branding off there if you want to. But right now you are co branding with the company as far as your profile, as far as the kind of invitations that you might set, set end or language or content that you might send out and engage with. Always make it your own voice. You know, that's what that's what we were just talking about. If you're if you're leaving voicemail messages or video messages or even written messages and you would never say hey, Um, you know, then say hi or if you but but if you never say dear Ethan, then say Hey Ethan. You know, you've you've got to at least align it to who you are, because that in authenticity will absolutely show through if you're forcing something that's inauthentic. So, to your point, there's a there's a balance between how far am I comfortable in co branding with my company on Linkedin and and and air? Where can I just say no and where can I just like go okay, well, they probably know what they're talking about, so I'll give it a try and see how it does and where can I, you know, go? That's awesome. I'm gonna jump in. And it's never all of the above, right. It's always little bits of this, that and the other. Um as far as as far as engagement on Linkedin, but the short answer is, you know that your your employee owns their own linkedin profile. I'm glad we don't do, you know, face selling with facebook, selling with twitter, selling with Tiktok, selling with clubhouse, because to me those other platforms are, you know, even with with my own engagement, are much more personal and I would feel super uncomfortable doing what I do on Linkedin on facebook, but linked in it is kind of business focused. So so, like everything else, there's a gray area in between. There's always well, we're really grateful and thankful that you contributed to human centered communication and you've got to join us again here on on the podcast and you know, as we're working to get the book out, we know you had limited time with the book, but you have had a little bit of time with the book. Is there a particular chapter or a particular topic that you were most excited about to get out there in the world beside besides yours? Of course, besides our own right exactly. Well, yeah, beyond Mario's and mind. Of course you should read those. No, I think, because I think that there are so many great chapters. Um. But what I want to highlight, I think because of what we were talking about and being uncomfortable with Cameron. You know, are you know, is it possible that some people are not made for camera? Um, I would definitely recommend chapter six, Julie Hansen's, because, you know, she talks all about preparing for the camera. Um, you know, authenticity, acting, pre preparedness, confidence, alignment, listening and being presents audience...

...of one messaging. So definitely, Um, Julie's chapter and then also Lauren Bailey's chapter two, because I think it's going to allow people to, Um, to get more comfortable with the whole concept. So I would I would point out Julie and Lauren's chapters, as well as, of course, Mine and Mario's. But I mean it's hard to pick a favorite right, because there's, there's just there's. Yeah, there, there really are there chapters here that are going to address those areas where you just need to improve and address the areas that you're like God, no, Awesome Uh. So for folks who are listening, you can hear conversations even at advance of of getting the book, which is available for pre order at bombomb dot com slash book, or you can email book at Bom Bomb Dot Com with any questions, especially about ordering copies for your team or your entire organization or for people in your network. If you want to dive deep right now with some of these folks and their unique expertise. These are conversations that are complementary to what you'll find in the book. You're not redundant at all and you can go right now to bombomb dot com slash podcast and hear the conversation with Mario Martinez, junior, founder and CEO of Van Dress. So you can hear the conversation with Lauren Bailey, founder and president of both factory and Girls Club. You can hear our conversation with Julie Hansen, who created these selling on video master class, among varieties. She's written like three books now all around, and she was a professional actress, which is really cool, that intersection of sales, acting and video. And you know, to use a word that you used in that linkedin response at the end. There um the authenticity that's required to do each of those things very well. Uh, and, of course, coming up in the series, to conclude, we have Adam Kantos, CEO of Remax, a brand that everyone is familiar with. So, Um, that's bombomb dot com's podcast, or bombom com slash book. Steve. We can't let Vivica go without learning more about her, so give her a couple opportunities to share to two opportunities. The first one, thanker, mentioned someone who's had a positive impact in your life or career. You know, and people are probably those who follow me and have heard me before probably sick of this, but I already mentioned the Klt factor that no like and trust. Um, my friend Bob Berg actually kind of launched my career. He I. I used to share his book. Um, well, certainly endless referrals, but also go givers long before I started online. and Um, so when I first started on social I you know, I put it out there. Does anyone know? You know if at Bob Berg is on social anywhere? And he responded right away on twitter and Um invited me to his conference and we've actually become very good friends. But I quote him all the time, all things being equal, people do business with people they know, like and trust, and I think nowadays that is more important than ever. And I think video, as I mentioned, adds that K and L and t to the no like and trust factor. So Bob Berg is a huge and continues to be a huge influence for me. Yes, we we agree with no, like and trust and been using that for years as as well. Um, let's take it a step higher. Let's go with brand or company that has delivered you an amazing customer experience. Yeah, you know, just recents, so funny, like yesterday. So there's Um, a woman's brand of workout clothing, because that's that's one thing I've started doing during the pandemic, called Women's best. They're they're based in Europe and they had a big sale for father's Day, ironically, Um, and I bought a bunch of stuff and, you know, production they ran out. Um. So not only did they refund me the money, obviously, of the items they couldn't they couldn't deliver, they then gave me a credit um for the amount...

...that I had spent, even though they refunded me the full amount, plus they gave me an extra fift and I'm like, okay, all you have to do is refund me in a timely manner. But they they went above like so, so far above and beyond Um. And this is a European company. So what do they care really, Um, and the fact that, you know, the fact that they did, that they had a great kind of apology letter. Um, that just the whole the whole experience went made me go from I'm never ordering from them again right, if they can't get the stuff that they put on there and then I bought, I'm not gonna buy from them again too. I not only when, you know, I took my credit Oh yes, I did. I, you know, not only spent all that money, but I spent even more money, which they may or may not be able to deliver the product. But and and you know, the product. I finally got the first shipment and the products awesome and I love it. And so it's uh, you know that that just from a to Z, the whole experience was positive. So good is this? This ability not only to manage expectations up front, obviously to exceed them whenever possible, but then to recover in moments of failure or even just disappointment, maybe the company didn't fail at all. In this case. It sounds like they did, um, but this ability to recover makes such a big impact. Great Story. Thank you for sharing that and thank you for spending this time with us. VIVICA, you're awesome. For people who enjoyed this and want to follow up, where would you send them to learn more about you, the videos that you create, the courses that you teach, the books that you've written and what you and your team are doing at Van Gresso? Yeah, obviously go to Van Gresso. That's one. S V E N G R S O dot com Um, and if you go to Vangresso DOT COM, forward slush resources. We have so many great free resources for you to check out, out about all aspects of social selling, not just videos. So definitely check those out. If you want to connect with me, like just literally Google linkedin expert Um and my linkedin profile should be the first. Well, we'll see. It depends where you're calling in from my guests, but it should be one of the first profiles that shows up on Google. So please reach out and please let me know that you heard me on this podcast and I'd be happy to connect. Awesome. Thank you so much in the future will be virtually selling and serving more often, but the channels we're trying to connect and communicate through our noisy and polluted and our faceless digital communication is both visually and emotionally impoverished. So how do we stand out? How do we truly connect? How do we make people feel like people and not like numbers? Get answers to these questions and more from more than a dozen experts, including a marketing futurist from else force, the first salesperson at Hubspot, two co founders of Van Gresso and an emotional intelligence expert with seven US patents in the analysis of facial coding data by the Wall Street Journal Bestseller Human Centered Communication, a business case against digital pollution. Learn more about human centered communication at bomb bomb dot com slash book. That's BOM bomb dot com slash book. Thanks for listening to the customer experience podcast. Remember the single most important thing you can do today is to create and deliver a better experience for your customers. Continue Learning the latest strategies and tactics by subscribing right now in your favorite podcast player or visit bomb bomb dot com slash podcast.

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