The Customer Experience Podcast
The Customer Experience Podcast

Episode · 1 year ago

61. Creating Instant Connection With Anyone You Want to Know w/ James Carbary


If you want your business to grow and succeed, it needs to be built on a solid foundation of relationships. Obviously. However, creating connection with the right people can be quite difficult — even damaging — if you go about it the wrong way. What if I told you that creating connection is as simple as collaborating with anyone you want to know to create valuable content? 

This very episode of the Customer Experience Podcast is both a consequence of and a demonstration of content-based networking. About four years ago, I created some content with someone who is now my friend. It’s a relationship that grew relatively slowly. It took a couple of years of content collaboration before any deals were made. But this is what content-based networking is all about: making content with people with the aim of creating a connection that could turn into future business. You really have nothing to lose with this approach. Worst-case scenario – you end up with stellar content and new relationships. 

I’m so honored to introduce you to my friend James Carbary, Founder of Sweet Fish Media, host of B2B Growth, and author of Content-Based Networking.

What we talked about:

  • Improving CX with content-based networking 
  • Making your own luck to create valuable content and meaningful interactions 
  • Focusing on the process of building relationships instead of the outcomes 
  • Taking a journalistic approach to content creation 
  • Balancing online connection with offline connection

Check out these resources we mentioned during the podcast:

Subscribe, listen, and rate/review the Customer Experience Podcast on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Google Play or Google Podcasts, and find more episodes on our blog.

Content based networking essentially iscontent collaboration with the exact people that you want to know. So, in asales context, that's potential customers. The single most important thing you cando today is to create and deliver a better experience for your customers,learn how sales marketing and customer success experts create internalalignment, achieve desired outcomes and exceed customer expectations in apersonal and human way. This is the customer experience podcast, here'syour host, ethen beaute. We knew that we needed to connect withVPS of marketing at btob technology companies with fifty plus employees.That's a Ligne from a new book called content base. Networking its author andour guests today wanted to build relationships and create content withhis ideal customers. ATS sweetfish media. It's a company he founded thatproduces podcast for me to be brands turns out that was me, a VP ofmarketing at a BTB Tech Company with fifty plus employees. Nearly four yearslater. Here we are, we are friends, wee spent time in person several times wereeach each other's customers and we've produced several pieces of contenttogether. So what you're listening to right now is both a consequence of anda demonstration of content based networking, it's all very Meta, JamesCarbery, welcome to the customer Experience Podcast Man- I legitimatelyhave goose chills right now, and that was that was probably the best introI've ever heard in my life. Thank you so much that that is that's incrediblesure I mean, and none of it is really about what an awesome person you are.We could have gone down that road to, but here we are, it's so great to haveyou on the show. It's a show that your team is kind enough and excellent atproducing for me in the team here at Bombam. It's a pleasure to be yourcustomer, and so we'll start with you, where we always start with everyone,which is your thoughts on customer experience like what is that? What Whan,I say, customer experience. What does that mean to you yeah? So I read a bookprobably about a year ago called never lose a customer again by joy. Colemanyou've had hem on the show, we're both big fans of Joey and when I think aboutcustomer experience, so much of my thinking really comes from what Ilearned in that book. You Know Joey walks through eight phases that a customer goes through and I think upuntil reading that book, I thought that you know I've been spending the bulk ofmy time, thinking about really before people become customers right, it's thesales and marketing. Well, what's the experience leading up to someone beinga customer and in Reading Jolie's book and seeing that that's really onlythat's that s stage one, but it's only one of eight stages and after readingthat book we started really thinking about what are ways that we can beintentional and thoughtful throughout the entire customer experience andanother kind of big takeaway for me from that book, and it's really shapedanswering your question. What I think about customer experiences instead ofyou know so often in companies you celebrate when you, you know close anew deal, whin, that new business you bring the sales gone. You do all thecelebratory things there, but what Joey says in the book is, you shouldactually be not celebrating until you get the first result for your customer,because that's that's why they signed up was to get an actual result fromyour pridate or from your service, and so just reorientto Gar, our thinkingaround that. So it's a that's, probably a much longer answer than than that Ishould have given and but but that's how I think about it. It's customerexperience is geving a result for your customer and I think doing that doingthat in a way that is thoughtful and intentional is how really, I thinkabout customer experience. It's awesome. That was a great book and I was so gladto have thim on the show. So actually...

...that was a great answer as long as itwas because a you left, people with something they can do go read, neverlose a customer again or check out. I forget which episode it is somewhere inthe teens on this show to get into that and you're. Exactlyright is so many business finles syod you and I both have in the businessesthat were in you founded yours. I work in mine. It's recurring revenue right,it's you know you need that. You want that person to stay for three years,five years, eight years and then, of course, all the other good things, andso it's especially important to have that mindset, O of impact and newimpact and repeated impact or results is the word you use so love it greatreference. So talk about that practically maybe give one or twothings like: What did you do inside sweetfish media specifically toward this effort? Yeah? So gettingyou figuring out in that book and Never Lose Tha customer again? They talkabout this feeling of buyers remorse and we sell into larger companies. Sothese are companies that you know ther theyre marketing decision makers, butin a lot of ways this is you know this is a really big risk for them. Sotheyre you know their CMO is going to be looking at this initiative. You knowin six months or a year and they're going to be held accountable to Hey dithis podcast idea that you have actually work, and so when a marketermakes a decision to work with us, there are real life consequences for that,and because of that, there's a common emotion that comes along with making abig purchase decision and it's byers remorse. And so, when I read that partof the book, I thought man. What can we do to help alleviate that buyers,remorse that our customers are inevitably feeling whenever they sign acontract to work with us? For you know, six months or a year, and when I thoutman we have a really, we have a really fun culture. We've got a reallyfriendly team. What if we sent these little videos shortly after someone,you know sisigned the deadl and we got them introduced to their producer andstarted our process. What if we just sent a little video? That said, youknow hey sally and the rest of the team at you know: Xyz Corp, I'm going to beyour producer, really looking forward to work em with you on this, and thenit pans over to our coo, who says hello and it's a personal eye greeting, andso we started doing these and honestly, you know even it had such a biggerimpact than we get more comments on that little two minute, video that wesend that shows the faces of six or seven people from our team. Then we dofrom so many other things that we've done. I mean we've done these elaborate.You know paintings for new customers where we put their face next to you,know Oprah and Ellen and Jimmy Falin, and we had you know some people thatacknowledge that they got it, but most people, you know didn't really sayanything about it. These videos that we send it blows people away, and you canjust tell like theye're so much more excited about getting started whenthey've seen this little video. So that's one. That's one little kind ofmicro thing that we've incorporated into our customer experience in termsof delivering a result. One thing that we did was really tighten up our launchprocesses so that we could we could, from our side, be able to confidentlysay we are doing everything we can to be able to get your show live withinthirty to forty five days, because we know that if we can get your show upand going in a very brief time window, then you're going to start seeing theresults of the relationships you're forming with your guests, the content.That's coming out of that that you're, you know that we're repurposing onLinkdin for you, those types of things so tightening up that lunch process andthen those little videos that we started doing both have beengamechangers from a customer experience. You know you know warms my heart tohear you say how effective a simple video is. I love the one that Ireceived because it's and we will not have a gift ology conversation. I hearthat's a separate episode and you're a...

...master of it, but it was. You know itwas about me and you have a distributed team, and so I got to see all thesedifferent people and if I need to reach out like they're real people nowthey're, not just Einga signatures or titles or whatever it's just such anice. Warm touch, love it thanks for those examples, let's switch over tocontent base networking but stay in the same zone. Here when I read contestcontent base, networking which was a great read, sofun super practical,really good stories tips tactics Etceta. It immediately occurred to me that itflips a couple big pieces of customer experience on its head, especially upin kind of like that prospecting area. It's kind of like the newntworking partof it is like, let's get to know each other eah. But how do you think aboutcontent base? Networking relative to customer experience to if I matsh thosetwo things together? Is that do anything for Yous that interested YeahYeah? So I think it has a lot to do with it. Just because so much ofcustomer experience, I mean the title of Your Book. You know rehumanize yourbusiness like it's. It's humanizing a a mode of communication and when youthink about when you think about like business, development and sales and thestuff that happens on the on the front and like the prospecting activity,that's typically a very on we've made it a very inhuman thing. We send outthese mask glast emails, where we put a token in for their first name and maybetheir company name, but you can smell those things from a mile away asopposed to flipping it a little bit and saying hey what if I actually wantedwhat? If I actually tried, collaborating with this person tocreate some content with them, knowing that that's ultimately going to createa relationship that could actually turn into business? And you alluded to- Imean that's how I met you n. We were doing a virtual summat. It wasn't evenyou weren't, even a Guestar podcast, for a while, after that, you ereAguinst Tar, a virtual summit that we were doing, and I think it was content,summat, seventeen or something Soi was three years ago and through that webuilt a meaningful relationship. We talked about podcasting a little bit atthe end of that conversation, and but it was, I think, a year or two down theroad before we ended up working together and and that's okay, becausewe created this genuine human connection, and I think, when you thinkabout customer experience, it's so much about humanizing the experience. That'swhy I love so much and why we use mom bomb at tweetfishes, because ithumanizes the interaction in a way that very it's really hard to do. But I thinkcontent collaboration takes that to even even another level of actuallylike being able to work on a piece of content together with someone thatmakes the person you're wanting to connect with look awesome, yeah, it'sso good. I actually missed the step. I should have asked you to give a just a definition like you define itvery nicely and concisely in the book a couple different times and even acouple different ways, but for folks that are listening right now. What iscontent based networking yeah, so content based networking essentially iscontent collaboration with the exact people that you want to know. So, in asales context, that's potential customers, so, if you're selling to if you're se, you like us, if you'reselling to v Piece of marketing ABTB TAT companies with fifty posent,believes, go and create content with those people like we do want our showbe to be growth, or you know, variety, we've done virtual sommits whoe done alot of different things where we can collaborate with them, but it also ttranscends that to ethen, because if you're, you know, if you're a collegestudent that just graduated- and you really want to work at a particularcompany in your city- that's one of words like Bombom has best. You knowbest place to work. You want to work there. How do you do it? Well, what ifyou? What? If you came up with a series of videos that you did on Youtube,where you interviewed a bunch of hiring managers at all the different bestplaces to work in your city or in your region or whatever creating contentwith those hiring managers you created off of those relationships, there's apretty good chance! You're, probably going to have your resume is going togo to the top of the stack whenever those companies start hiring for aposition that you're interested in can also. You know it can work in politics,it can work. You know- and this is one...

...of the stories in the book. If you'reyou know an aspiring actor connecting with casting directors in your city andcreating content with casting directors about what it takes to be a successfulcasting director. Naturally, your creating friendships with the peoplethat are going to hire, hopefully your next role, and so it applies welloutside of well outside of you know, a sales context. It's also incredible formarketers, because you're getting insight into the minds and the brainsof your potential and existing customers, understanding what makesthem tick and theyre and and what are their challenge, what their challengesare because of the content that's coming out of it. So there's a lot ofdifferent use cases, but at the end of the day, it's content collaborationwith the exact people that you want to know great, and one of the chaptersends with a really nice. It's almost it's a full page of examples like youjust offered theirs like it's so useful in a variety of ways, and one of myfavorite things came toward the end, which was this is a can't losesituation. The very worst case scenario is: If you pursue this and pursue itfor a little bit, you're going to wind up with some new relationships, ayou're in ta wine up with sof content, that's the worst case in e good rightgood. I just wanted to lay that out for folks foere listening like I just youknow, read the book, Love The book, and so I'm all steeped in it needed to backout there and make sure everyone knew we were talking about before yeacaust.What I would like to do with this conversation is therere like four R,like high level themes that I loved in the book, and so I'm just going to kindof walk through each of those and maybe just get a little bit of reaction fromyou or you know elaborate or whatever, and the first one is something thefirst two are. What I call this theme is what I call you make your own luck,and so here's quote fror Obra just to illustrate it. You Lean on Oprah alittle bit in the book. Luck is a matter of preparation, meetingopportunity, Ray Crock for McDonald's luck is e dividend of sweat, the moreHEU sweat the luckier you get, Ralph Waldewemerson great thinker,shallow people believe in luck or circumstance, strong people believe incause and effect right, and so all of that stuff just really spoke to me,because you really draw this line between Seran dipity luck and hopeversus intention action and working backward talk about why that's soimportant for you personally and then also of course, what that means in this.In this context of content base, networking yeah, I love. I love thatyou brought this up even is, is super important to me again. I've got, youknow, got got goose, chills thinking about this content. This is our thirdcore value in our business. So we have three court values, love people, well,never stop! Learning and the third one is owned. The result- and that's reallywhat this is about, so in our context it has to do with owning customer sultsand owning the results of Y. U Ow different different facets with thebusiness, but this concept is really owning the result of your life, one ofour coure values for our family is right. Your story. I think I think wehave a lot more to say about the path that we go down in life then oftentimes a lot of people give themselves credit for, and instead of letting lifehappen to you, I believe that you can be a more activeparticipant in your own life and that you can make decisions and choices muchmore intentionally and thoughtfully about what you want to be doing. I youknow: There's there's thes, two stats that boggle my mind that you know wespend ninety thousand hours of our life at work, but eighty seven percent ofAmericans have no passion for what they do and I think man, ninety thousandhours. That is a lot of time, and so many people, just let their careerhappen to them. They let what this thing they do from nine to five happendto them, because they happend to get this degree in accounting, and thenthey got this internship out of college and they just stuck around at thecompany for twelve years, because it was easy and but they hate going towork every day they hate doing what they do and so in the book. I reallywanted to open people's minds to thinking. You know everyone says thatrelationships are so important. It's... know that Youre, your net worth isdefined by your network and Yo all these different tropes around the youknow when you know the right person things happen, but there's I don't feellike. There's anybody saying that. Well, how do you actually create those rightrelationships? Everybody saying that relationships are really important andthen we should all. We should all know people, it's not what you know to youknow. Well, how do I know who I want to know and this strategy, this approachmethodology whatever you want to call it allows you to take that into yourown hands, because you're not waiting on the person that you want to know tohappen to run into them an an imperson event at a conference chamber ofCommerce meeting, whatever you're proactively putting the ownness on youto say man. What content can I go out and create with this person? It waseverybody going to say yes to you if you're trying to collaborate with BillGates on a content project, the likelihood Bill Gates says yes to youand you know unless you're, unless you're someone was cool as ethen,probably not going to happen, but there's so many there's so muchopportunity here because and you're putting the responsibility on yourselfis opposed to making excuses or giving someone else, the ownership of yourlife and your story and what you want to accomplish. So that's what I love somuch about that. I'm glad you brought that up. Good yeah is a really powerfultheme start to finish I mean you know even just the way I open this podcastthe level of intention of it. First, you started reaching out to salespeople and then you're like a wait, no they're, referring me to marketer. So,let's go, you know, talk to CMOS and O' like wait. This decision isn't beingmade in the CMO seat. It's VPS of marketing is worth this Ian have likejust like that level of intention. You make your own luck, good one number two.This is what I call be of value and abundance will follow. HMM- and this isthat's a that's, a Montre or or a philosophy or mission statement of ourmarketing team here at Bombam that we generated- I don't know- maybe a yearand a half ago, but I felt like in the book there's this really strong themeof focusing on the process, not on the outcome, focusing on the relationshipnot on the transaction and again that cut that worst KA scenario deal whereit's like. You know you get a relationship and you get content.That's the worst thing. That's going to happen O on so this idea of you know Ifeel like we spent so much time focused on and like you were talking about,even in defining customer experiences like you know, we were so focused ongetting the sale and what that meant was we were losing sight of. You knowthe rest of the relationship talk a little bit about focusing on theprocess more so than the outcome like I feel like. If you invest inrelationships, good things are going to happen. essecially if you do it at thislevel of intention yeah it's one of the thing you know I put my. I put my phonenumber in the back of the book and it's been really bedn there twice yeah it'sbeen, it's been really fun, just getting text passages from people thatare reading it, and this weekend I was. I got a text from a guy. I D never methim before he read the book and he asked me said James How you know how long should I expect it to takebefore I close the deal from one of these relationships and as soon as Housaid it I get. I get it. I empathize with it right, like you're, doingyou're doing a strategy because you want to get you want to get resultsfrom it, but as soon as he asked, I thought like. I hope he doesn't Miss It.I hope he doesn't miss the macro reason why you're doing this and he ended upcircling back and he's like. I know I know it's all about the relationships Ijust kind of want to mentally. have an idea of you know what I should expector what a benchmark was what a bench park would be and but I think, focusingon the process of like a systematic approach of creating relationship afterrelationship after relationship that, if you're, if you're approachingrelationships with the right people with people that can actually make adecision for your product of service you're, naturally going to eithercreate a piece of content that attracts that person that you, maybe you didn'teven have them on your show. But the content you created attracted thatperson which happens, or you end up talking to someone that can work withyou and that sometimes that takes six...

...days. Ike Hat a story that I shared inthe book. Sometimes it takes, you know a year and a half like you know oursituation of you and I connecting but people the thing I'll say aboutfocusing on the process. Is people can smell in authenticity from a mile away?Again, I don't want this to be a bombomb infomercial, but the reasonthat, like your videos, when you send a bom on the video to me and and anyoneelse that you're sending thim to your authenticity shines through in such apowerful way that it covers up, it covers up so many yeah, so manyother things that can be misunderstood when you're on a podcast interview orwhether you're doing a virtual summit or a blog or a instagram. You knowseries with somebody if you're collaborating with somebody I incontent and they can sniff like. Oh you just ask me to do this because you wantto sell me your widgit or you want to sell me on your coaching program or youknow, whatever they're not going to want to work with you again. They mightbe nice to you and, like Oh yeah, that's that's! You know we'll thinkabout it, but they're going to have a bad taste in their mouth and it'sultimately going to damage your reputation long term, where, if you aregenuinely going into it, with the intent of creating really good content,that's going to be super helpful to the persona that you're trying to serve andyou're trying to make them look great in the process. When that's your focus exactly what yousaid, even the the natural byproduct is that people will want to work with you,and so, if you're, looking at this and you're coming out of it going okay, wecan we can test this and we've got you know X, number of months. Until youknow we have to produce a deal out of it. That's going to produce t the wrongkind of behavior, and if you start doing this and you're saying hey we'regoing to have our sales team te co host of the show and and really all you'redoing is, is a veiled attempt at getting on a discovery. Call people aregoing to see it and it's just it's not going to work long term. So Iappreciate you, you bringing that up because that's that's honestly, a fearof mine and why there's very few reasons that I don't like talking aboutthis, because I think it can be it's transformative. Obviously I wrote abook about it. I'm super passionate about it, but the one thing that scaresme is this methodology or this this approach in the hands of someone that is not authentic or doesn't actually careabout relationships with people can go very, very wrong and it can actually bevery damaging yeah. It's I like you are for that caution. I actually see thesame thing with video. You know I, the text you got where I'm glad the guycame around a little bit, but this this. So how long is it going to take to turnthis into money? Go Right, Yo get the seat like when someone's follow aquestion for me about. You know sending these simple casual, conversationalvideos through Bombam when they're like can I make it seem like it's just forthat person by faking something in the beginning of the video, but it'sactually for everybody like you're doing it wrong. Man, like N,there's some videos that should on ever green and it's okay, but just don't actlike there's something else: Yeah really good caution. There sevwasnumber two number three journalism and journalistic work. You use thislanguage a lot and I really like it. I mean a I used to work with journalistsrunning marketing inside local TV stations. I guess some people mightroll their rise or ask questions about how journalistic that is. But I workedwith some legitimate awesome journalist in my career and so and I really likethe way that translates into content creation and distribution. You know anall the various forms you talk about in this book. So talk a little bit aboutjournalism and like. Why do you like that language? How did you adapt it,and you had a couple great examples in there too this. This is actually thispigkybacks really well of what we're just talking about. I think the morejournalistic your approachis to the content, collaboration that you'redoing with the folks that you want to...

...connect with think the more the morejournalistic the more it warms, the other person to you when they see thatyou are serious, taking the content very seriously. Not obviously you don'twant to take it so serious that makes somebody uncomfortable, but when theysee that you've done your homework like you do this masterfully well Eten. Wetalk to other customers about how well you do this, but the amount of researchthat you do go you know on the person that you're about to talk to yourreferencing things from earlier in their career or from content thatthey've created elsewhere that subcommunicates something to the guestthat Oh this. This is this is the real deal. This person really cares aboutthe content, that's being created here, one it kind of set it levels ituplevels the bar, like Oh man. I really need to deliver here, because this isthis is going to be. This is really good stuff. The host has done theirwork now. I need to show up and do the work for me. So it's creating trust onon a different level when you approach this from a v from a journalisticstandpoint like when you're really caring about the content thattranslates to how the guest then sees you and which, which, if they're, ifthey're, trusting you during the creation of the content than the aftereffect. And what happens you know in the post, interview conversation or thesecond or third time that you guys end up talking, because now, your friends,because you've created this content, it's going to translate there becausethey see you as a journalist and not somebody just trying to sell somethingor somebody trying to get a job or somebody. You know that whatwhatever itis that that your ultimate dream is and and the thing that you want toaccomplish- you want them to not see. You is somebody just trying to reachthat, but somebody that's truly trying to create exceptional contentent. Andso, when you look at this from a journalistic really trying to hone inon your journalistic skill, just curiosity asking great questionsknowing how to do some research. This applies both on the front end andduring the interview so the front and work of even asking themto be on the show. We found that if you can do just a little bit ofpersonalization and say Hey, I read this chapter in your book that wasfascinating to me. I'd love to bring you on the customer experience podcastto talk to you about this idea and how it relates to customer experience thatask is so much more likely that the person is going to say. Yes, then, ifyou just said Hey, I want to have you on my podcast now I want to have you onmy podcast is much s a much more likely way to engage. Somebody then hey. Iwant to get you on a twenty minute demo of my software product, so you're stillyou're still doing it better than most by just asking them to be on your show,but man when you take it to that. Next level you said: Hey, I saw that articleyou put on link en three months ago and you've said something about Dedada thatman, I think I just think our listeners would get a ton of value out of that orour audience would get a ton of value. Out of that, would you mind: Would yoube up for doing a fifteen minute conversation about it and that's that'sbeing a journalist and that's that's being somebody of values, because,because Youre, the value that you bring is a journalist is that you can bringawareness to somebody's thoughts, ideas, passions and there's very few peoplethat don't want exposure for their ideas right. So good, I'm just going toread you aligne from from your book, just because this is just nice littlebutton on it, curiosity, passion and a focus on great content or what make ajournalist journalist, not fancy equipment, be you know, I think a lotof people hang themselves up. The other thing I was thinking about in readingthrough that section, a couple sections that really focused on this. What youjust offered is, you know I felt like the impostor syndrome right. I rememberwhen we first started selling our software. I was going into communitiesand specific industries and and teaching video in their language, and Iwas like you know, I'm a little bit of... impostor here, so you just interviewsome customers and get to know it. Like honestly, I did not know a ton aboutcustomer experience, but I was very very curious and I knew that it wasvery important, and so I felt a little bit like an empastor. I mean when youget a guy like joy coleman on the show you're like man, this guy's been beenteaching and training customer experience for years. You know, but then you realize my only job is touse your language from the book is to shine the spotlight on him. Yep Unlockhis expertise, unlock his unique perspective and just make him thesuperstar and I'm just the vehicle for that and I lerin the process. It'sexcellent, which also reminds me of another thing: That's great about thebook is this idea of when you hang our on experts. You come to be seen as anexpert such a such a fun idea, and it's true. I get called into conversationson Linkedin now, specifically because people know that this is what I do. Allthe time is talk to talk to people about creating and delivering betterexperiences. So, okay, Ye last one and you're a master at this. It is how wegot to meet in person. The very first time talk about the relationshipbetween online and offline. You do a great job. In the book of I mean, firstof all, th the the chapter on email writing was just spot on as someonewho's written a mountain of emails and taught about email right, that's agreat chapter on son, but you know you talk about some online activity andsome offline activity to to generate these conversations and, of course, todo the to do the content itself talk about the relationship between onlineand offline yeah. So I think there's there's definitelysomething to be sad about the inimacy that comes whenever you're meeting withsomebody in person. Now I'm a I don't know if you're a five lovel languagesguy, I'm a physical touch guy. So whenever I meet in person, I'm a huggerso like complete stranger, you know so so it's especially pertinent for mebecause a lot so much of my personality, it's just impossible to come through ina digital, chalike this because I can't you know, I can't I can't you know hugyou and like and and be genuine to myself in that way, through a digitalplatform. Now we've obviously done you know e think B to be growth. whove doneover thirteen hundred interviews now so and the lion share of those probablyninety nine point: Nine percent of those have been done digitally so I'm afan, and I love the flexibility and the ability to not make exexcuses. So wecan talk to anybody. We've had people in the show from Australia, we've hadpeople on the other side of the country and the only thing shopping it. Thereis time zone stuff and that's really easy. That's a really easy hurdle toovercome, but I think it was last it was year before last we started doingthese BTB growth dinners, where I was popping into different cities all overthe country where I knew we had guests and I'm pretty sure that was. That wasthe first time you and I got to meet up and Maand. There was just something specialabout it being able to be in the same room with somebody, so there'sdifferent folks in in are there. There are people in different industrieswhere I think in person. Content is the absolute way to go financial advisorsbeing one insurance folks in the insurance space, maybe even like localmarketing agencies, folks that sort of a local client base. If you servecustomers locally, you know finance insurance, O e those types of roles,doing a show about successful people in your city, and you can name it avariety of different ways, but doing some sort of content where you'rehighlighting the success stories in your city and then being able to go upand to their office or meet with them in person to create content with Hem. Ican guarantee you that the relationship is going to expedite and its depthnessso much faster than it would, if you're doing these digitally now, becausewe've done them digitally so much...

...ther're things. We've learned aboutlike hey getting to the second collaboration or the second reason totalk to someone- that's not you know, hey want to buy my product is a reallyimportant step, because when someone has talked to you more than once thatI've noticed that, after that, second interaction is really when someonewould consider you to be a friend just having a one off interaction with them.People have a lot of run off interactions. You have one offinteraction with the guy that you know that works at the car wash booth thatyou go to on h on, but but but actually connecting withsomebody a second time whether it's a second content collaboration R, it'ssomething else that you're working on is really powerful. So so, but ifyou're in person you get that all in one, it's it'sin that first that firsttrip, because because of the power of being in person, so that's how I thinkabout offline online. I love doing both. Obviously, the scale of offline isenormous, the opportunity of being able to c you know. Yeur in Coloro SpringsI'm in Orlando, and we can still do this content collaboration, otherwise,wouldn't wouldn't wouldn't happen very often I if we had to wait till we werein person. So that's how I think about it. That's great! I knew you were mypeople, our people, when you're like hey, you know I just committing to geton an airplane and go to these cities wrere. I know I know people that I'vecollaborated with just a meetim in person, an ta it as great, and weproduce a piece of content while you're here yeah. I link that up by the way,folks who are listening. I write all of these up at mmcom podcast, and so, ifyou want to you, know, links obviously to the book and some of these otherthings, but also to probably our third or fourth contentcollaboration, I'll drop, Tatin Im, so you, your courte values, are obviously veryimportant to you. I know how thoughtful you were about them. They point to justbeing a really awesome human, but something that I didn't know you watarticulated. Just as clearly was your mission, so I'm just going to read itand I love for you just to share some thoughts on it. Our dream at sweetfishis to educate one million leaders every single day, because when leaders learn,the world gets better, yes yeah, so so this is something wwe're superpassionate about, and it's a relatively new kind of turn for us. As a companyfor the past several years, we've been focused on really being a serviceprovider, so we know podcasting really well and we produce podcast forcompanies like Bommom and a lot of you know a lot of other different folks,but really being the the execution of the actual service and what we'restarting to do more and more of is really we're transforming into a mediacompany and what that looks like, I think, is transforming into aneducation company. So, as we start to own more of our own shows and buildaudiences for these owned properties in different industries, we've got a showcalled the manufacturing show. E'v got the BTBCIL show. Obviously ourflyingship show be to be growth for BB marketers, we're about to launch theCIO show. So we've got all these different shows a show for HR and CEOScalled crafting culture. It's all about company culture to show I'm reallysuper excited about. So, as we start to start our own shows, we were reallythinking you know trying to press into. Why are we doing this? And and whatwhat's the end goal here and the? Why you know really coming back to what Iwas saying: Thos, those two stats, those two stats that I shared earlier.You know I want to inspire. I want to inspire people to own their careerbecause ninety thousand hours of your life shouldn't suck, and if I want toinspire you to own your career, then I think I think we can educate you withthe type of content we're creating on these shows, and so how do we potifythat? Make that a tangible kind of how do we educate more people? Well, wewant to educate a million people every single day and that's an audacious goalfrom where we're at right. Now you Kno Beuto, be Gro skitting, just over ahundred thousand dowloads a month. So it's not. You know it's nothing tosneeze at by any means that I'm super grateful for the audience we alreadyhave, but I think when people are...

...actively investing in personal andprofessional development and they're trying to learn a trying to grow andthey're trying to get better. I think the natural by product of that is thisfeeling of what we talked about earlier. In the interview of like they takeownership of their life and they no longer feel captive to their situationor their circumstance, but they take control and they start making actionsand decisions that point them in the direction they actually want to go asopposed to just being dragged along in life wherever life takes them, and Ithink education is a big way to do that. So that's the context. There tit'sawesome it's increasingly difficult to work here at Bombam, because I'msurrounded by people who read a ton of books and listen to a tonof podcast, which is what I do anyway. But now it's like, I know, joke I'mlike six books, deep, you know and depending if it's writtenby an upcoming guest after, like restack at you, Ohta really good onesitting n spot number, five, that's like phase there. You know- and youknow, texting each other on the weekends like Hey. You got to hear thisepisode of this show and you're gonna love when this lady shares this thingabout that other thing and it' just really good. It's! Yes, it makeseverything so much more fun, and I love that you have this. This education andleadership blend. I'm really excited for you. Thank you so much yeah I meanwe could we could go on and on honestly I mean before we hit Recordere.You know, yeah could have just had that conversation ever now like instantly,but but we're going to we're going to start winding it down here and SOM,going to wind down with your opportunity to think or mention someonewho's had a positive impact on your life or career, and to give a shout outto a company that you really appreciate a respect for the way they'redelivering for you as a customer yeah. So I think giving giving a shoutout to someone who's had an impact on me. I would have to say TNAT. This might be,this might be devisive and I know not at not. Everybody loves this guy, butman. Gary Vannerchuck has added a level of value to my life around just helpingme think about things in a different way than I mean to say he's. He beenthe largest influence on my entrepreneurial and of a tendency orapproach would be the understatement of the century. Just the the idea thatpatience is everything that life is really long. Why am I trying to likemake these make these decisions like I'm only going to live? For you knowtwo more years, it's like man, the likelihood is I'm going to be aroundhere for a long time, so slow down a bit, be patient and start building forthe long term, as opposed to being rushed and just making decisions thatare, in my short term best interest, but not necessarily my longterm bestinterest, and so Gary V is probably probably who I would shout out there,because man that guy you can see up here. I've got like all of his booksright up there and, and I just consume his youtube content and the stuff he'sput not on social like in the animal so Heis, who I would give credit to theregreat one, how about a company that you really appreciate for the way that youdeliver for you when you're on the customer side of the deal yeah. Sothere is a there's. A pizza shop by my old house is Joe's pizza, little localshop. I think they have. I think they have two shops now and they know. I wasfascinated by how this worked out, but there's a girl that works there. Hername is jasmine and I don't know if this is necessarily trained or if theyjust got a gym in jazz whenever they hired her. But I come in and I don'teven have to tell her my order. She's like got it cute up and she's like allright. It's going to be nine, an eghty eight and I'm like Jazzike. How do youhow an and I've seen her do it for other people? So it's not like you knowI. I do go there a lot so that that's probably an indictment on my pizzaeating habits, but the fact that she like she knows like she's like, Oh,don't you know, don't forget your cup...

...for your die coke and I'm like man likejust the thoughtfulness of she knows her. Customers really really well, andI know that's not profound and I know Y A. I listen to your show and I hearpeople talk about kind of the local. You know a lot of local mom and popshops that are delivering on this experience, but I think the simplicityof it is what makes it so powerful. We don't need to overcomplicate how tocreate an incredible customer experience for someone. It's bethoughtful like be be interested, know your customer really well and andthat's something that jazz has done exceptionally well for me at Joe'spizza. That's so good! It reminds me of the of those stats that you offeredhere that as just so sad, it's like if you're disengageding your work, thenyou're not going to show up in a way where you're, caring and just the ideaof being in. I I can't imagine living in a state where I don't care about,what's going on around me and the people who are around me and the thepositive consequences of the work that I do like, I can't imagine being in aplace of not caring, and so you know when you're working at a pizza shop,you know you might have in the back of your mind, you know this is just fornow. Until I finish my degree or until I you know complete the training orwhatever, but just that respect for yourself and for the customer to showup and care and what it does for you. I think I think I m theorizing I thinkwhat's going on for you, there is she's saying through her behavior. I see you.I recognize you. I appreciate you, I know something about you and, and so wecan skip through all the transactional stofd. I'm just going to take youstraight there and that, just again you did a great job of talking about kindof like the message under the message or the message under the behavior. Itjust says: Hey James, welcome back yeah. Let's do this yeah and I mean theyrelike I go through seasons where I'm like really good on my diet and thenI'm not so good on my diet, and so she knows sh. She knows like hey. Is it DiaJames today or is it non diet because I've got go? I do the Greek Salad whenI'm when I'm dieet James- and I do the two slices of this awesome pizza- thatthey do whenever I'm Nondie James and so like, even just her understandingthe nuances of kind of the ruler coaster of my discipline, boward, mydiet, that kind of thing it's it's a level more than her, just knowing myname, although I think just knowing a name, would probably be a pretty prettygood step to aspire to yeah. But she goes. You know much further past thatand it's just I don't know, I just want to do business with with friends. Idon't think we use the term friendship enough in business, and it's really myyou know a big part of my mission as an entrreneurs to build businesses wherethere, where these these collaborations are happening and friendshipsareforming. I would consider you even to be a close friend of mine. I D it's.It feels weird to even say like Oh yeah, they're, a customer of ours, it's noEthens, a friend, yeah and and man. I think, if we as companies can aspire tobuild cultures where that is encouraged to you know what what would you do witha friend like? How would you get to know a friend better? Let's apply thatto how you're working with this particular customer, because the resultis likely going to end up being very similar. That's so good ind reminds meof the end of your mission statement or your goal statement or dream statement,which is the world gets better. It is a better world to live and work in whenwe approach our work. That way, this has been great. I appreciate you somuch. I consider you a close friend as well. I appreciate the work that you doand, most importantly, the way you go about it. I love what you've built. Ilove the sense of community around what you're doing, and so, if people enjoyedthis conversation and there they made it to the end is not a short. So so Iassume they're pretty into it. If people want to take another step, howdo they connect with you on Linkdin? How do they check out sweetfish how dithey check out btobe growth content...

...basement working? Where woeld you sendpeople yeah yeah? So so you can go to sweetfish, Mediacom and learned aboutwhat we do on the business side, I'm superactive unlinked in so just findingme finding me on Linkedin my last name is Pell Car Bary. I think I'm the onlyJames Carbery that pops up but you'll, see you'll, see you know the picture ofme and then the tag line is we produce podcast for B to be brand. So if thereis another gims car barry out therelet, just look for the thing that sayssomething about podcast and the dad line. I mind you don't meet Yeah Rightand then the book is, the book is onaudible and Amazon, so just searchcontent base, networking or again just search my name either on Amazon oraudible. If you want to listen to it, I read the book similar to what you andSteve Did for Rehumanize Your Business. So so you can hear me, read the book toyou or you can read it yourself, but would love love to get your feedback onit? Like I mentioned earlier, I put my phone number in the back of the book,and so, if you want to shoot me a text when you're done, I love havingconversations about what people are taken away from it and and what they'reyou know if they got any value out of it, which I hope it did. I would loveto have a conversation with you about it. Awesome I'd be shocked. If someonepicked it up, spent forty five minutes with it and did not say thousand orforty five minutes well spent. I appreciate that yeah. Thank you. Somuch for your time. Thanks for the insights, thanks for the way you viewthe world and inspiring other people to few it the same way awsome me thenthank you so much man, this his been incredible. I'm honored to have beenasked to be a Gueft, clear communication, human connection, higherconversion. These are just some of the benefits of adding video to themessages your sending every day. It's easy to do with just a little guidance,so pick up the official book, Rehumonize Your Business, how personalvideos, accelerate sales and improve customer experience learn more in ordertoday at Bombamcom Boock, that's bomb, tombcom fuck, thanks for listening tothe customer experience. podcast remember the single most importantthing you can do today is to create and deliver a better experience for yourcustomers, continue. Learning the latest strategies and tactics bysubscribing right now in your favorite podcast player, or visit Bombomcompodcast.

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