The Customer Experience Podcast
The Customer Experience Podcast

Episode 125 · 6 months ago

125. A Year From Now, You’ll Wish You Began Today w/ Joseph Jaffe

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

You want to level up your customer experience to customer obsession, but how?

Get started now. In a year’s time, you’ll wish you started today.

In this episode, I interview Joseph Jaffe, host of CoronaTV and Admiral/Co-Founder at The HMS Beagle, about the origins of his show and everything he’s learned along the way.

Joseph and I discuss:

- The availability heuristic (things that are harder to measure are the more important)

- How to implement customer obsession as a host

- The origin story for CoronaTV

- The art of having real conversations encapsulates entrepreneurship

Check out these resources we mentioned during the podcast:

- Watch CoronaTV

- Joseph wrote Flip the Funnel

- Joseph is also on Twitter

Subscribe, listen, and rate/review the Customer Experience Podcast on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Google Play or Google Podcasts, and find more episodes on our blog.

Listening on a desktop & can’t see the links? Just search for The Customer Experience Podcast in your favorite podcast player.

A'nd the worst listener in the world,but just the ability to stay silent and listen. You know, God gave us two years,one mouth: Let us use that in direct proportion, that's how I've implementedcustom experience or custom obsession. The single most important thing you cando today is to create and deliver a better experience for your customers,learn how sales marketing and customer success experts create internalalignment, achieve desired outcomes and exceed customer expectations in apersonal and human way. This is the customer experience podcast. Here'syour host ethen beaute nearly a year ago, is the coronavirus began to spreadaround the globe. Corona TV came to life. That's right. Today's gueststarted a live daily streaming show in response to the pandemic, so we'regoing to learn a little bit of the how and Wy behind it because you might bethinking about starting or improving your own show he's hosted on Corona TV,several guests from the customer experience podcast, including Brittany,Hodak, David Merrman, Scott Matthew, sweezy and coming soon mark Shaeffer,as well as marketing greats like Mitchjol, J bar Karyo Shag, gorgone andChris brogen he's a marketing grade himself and the author of five books,including built to suck and flip the funnel way back on episode. Four ofthis show he and I talked at length about built to suck in particular, andI'm pleased to have him back for episode hundred and Twenty Five hereJoseph Jaffy welcome to the customer experience podcast Wy, I feel like. Ishould be congratulating you forget about you talking about me. Maybe weshould reverse the roles, so I was. I was number four yeah and now I'm onetwenty five funly enough. By the way, I've started to do that now when Iactually introduce a guest, I put a number next to their name to signifywhere they are in the sequence, because I want them to realize that they'repart of this unfolding story in this...

...journey, and it's not episode numberit's guest number, because you know I'm celebrating them as opposed tointeresting Yeah Yeh. You number four I'm proud to welcome you back as guestnumber four I agoi will. I will treasure that number for the rest of mylife. That's Ri, that's really fun and it was. It was super kind of you. Imean when I reached out to have you on the show. A this show did not existlike there were. No, you know I think we recorded six or eight of themminimum before we actually released the show, and you were kind enough to giveme an hour of your time. I had read several of your books. AAs reallyexcited like I felt like I knew who you were. You were very early with video.You were very early with podcasting. As I mentioned, you had written severalbooks inside, I felt very familiar with you and I was excited to have aconversation with you, a just really kind of you to spend time with me whoyou did not know and a show that didn't exist at the time. I want to tell youthat I I spoke to someone the other day and I said I actually just almost quite prabadehim. I said if I am fortunate enough and privilegedenough to end up with a manager or an agent which I've never had. You knowI've never had anyoe'm Ne Bout, a book agent. I've done everything myself, butif I do, I will give them one brief and one brief only which is if ever someoneapproaches you for me to come on their show or starting out or their podcast,and you refuse them. I will fire you on the spot. You know it has always beenmy pledge and my commitment to help anyone looking to get into podcastingstreaming blogging and be on their show. I don't care, I will never ask themwhat their viewership is. I will never alsem what the metrics are. It's justthe right thing to do. I feel, and by the way you know you never know what will happen right. This is aboutpaying it, for this is about CIMMA, but it's really not macevellion in any way.It's just you know this to me is the fundamental you know: Tenant of socialmedia of community. You know of digital...

...the ability to connect people thatordinarily would never have been connected. I use the same approach nowwhen I'm looking for guests, for my show, I just you know, approach hem ontwitter or see if I can find the email address or you know, go to theirwebsite and you know what most will say. No, but some will say yes, James robinsWHO's. My favorite author in the World said Yes, and he came on the show andhe was just a cool relaxed, pragmatic kind, awesome person, so you know, andthat by the way is one of the. I don't even know if you plan to ars herquestion, but a lot of people ask me about guest relations and how do you doit? How do you get guess, and one of them is Likas a ask. You know peopleare accessible mors, more accessible than you think, and some of them areactually like kind. So, well, that's no her that we live in. It's amazing. Imean most people make themselves available whether it's through social,a lot of people, even just their email addresses, are easy to get, not thatthey not that everyone respo responds immediately to an email, because I'msure theire in boxes are jammed. But, like you, I had so many people say yesand it's just simply a matter of asking and you offered a couple reallyimportant things there. You said connection, I think relationship. Imean you never know the value of the connection that you're making in therelationship that you're building in the future, not that it's really atransactional thing at all. I also so appreciate that you went to Metrixlistenership et Cetera, like I have actually approached a couple of peoplewho I would have really liked to spend time and conversation with for thebenefit of learning about their experience and they aske those numbersand I gave them to them and they never respond and it's like Yuck. You know Imean, like you, know, there's so much tension between and it's been partbecause I'm spending a lot of time. Thinking about and even writing aboutthis is the measurables in the immeasurables. We all know that theimmeasurables have have a measurable value on our business. We just can'tassociate them necessarily, and so this...

...kind of gines that kind of Ror VesusRoi Conversation no you've had Ted Ruben on your show as well. So anyway,I appo fo Wat. I went there so I'll just take that I'll. Just take that upa notch which is yesterday on the show like yesterday on the show I had AndyCristadina and he discussed this idea, which a t thi S, this philosophy calledthe availability heuristic. Have you ever heard of that? No, but I like thesound of it and I a that da me work, I mean Noabaa right and what we reallyspoke about is you know how many people would like hire. You know someone likeAndy to say. I saw you speak three years ago and I've been waiting for theopportunity to be able to bring you in, but essentially the availability.houristic is the fact that the things that are the easiest to measure themetrics that are the easiest to measure are typically and the most visible R,typically, the less connected to real business outcomes and goals and theones that are more difficult and less to measure and less visible, are morealigned and more connected to you know profound business goals, and so friendsfans followers all the stuff that is so easy all those same metrics theyactually have. No bearing or impact certainly medium to long term on thestuff that count. Now, why don't even bring that up? What ads relevant to theconversation but be? It proves the point that you made, which is having aconversation with someone else, is going to make you smarter. If you arelistening and if you are learning- and I look back and- and I almost feel like how lucky am I to have had over ahundred and eighty conversations with people- diverse people, backgroundsperspectives, you know I said, enjoying the conversation which I wrote in twothousand and seven was published in two thousand and seven I said production isthe new consumption. So wenever people...

...ask me it's ironic what business bookshave read or recommend I'm like none? I don't read business box or it I'mcreating content, I'm actively like in it, and when I research someone or whenI'm talking to someone, I am learning, I don't need to read a book, even mine,even mine, you know- and so I just wanted to kind of like echo the factthat we have to be committed to the longgame. We have to be committed and understand the longterm impact ofrelationships, conversations community generosity. I could keep going on yeah,really good, so gosh, I guess I'll. I guess I'll try to hunter a little bitof the structure. The show I love that we just got right after it and youalready gave that that really nice availability here, houristic, I kind ofsaw this- is a conversation in three parts. I would like to kick off oncustomer experience. I want to get into the show I'm going to get into why youcreated it kind of what we experience today. If we join you live and when wejoin, you live versus what we were getting SA six months ago. You knowperhaps little bit about guest relations, etc, etce some of theproduction techniques. Frankly, because that's changed and Thet I've got a fewkind of broader theme, questions that I would love to get to if we have time,but I don't know that we will- and that's perfectly fine, so I guess I'llstart with customer experience when I say that what does that mean to youlike? What do you do? How do you define it or what characteristics might have?Well, I now use the term, which is something that I developed and then ironically, foundout that the term was first used by Jaff Bazos in his very first letter toshareholders. You Know Title Day, one the term is custom obsession I don'teven think hustome experiences enough or good enough anymore or service orit's customer obsession, but your question: how does that relate to theshow? Well, you know Steve Gorfield would say to me you shouldn't betalking about the audience. You should...

...be talking about the wood community.You should really be committing to community, so you know this whole ideaof servant leadership. I am at your service, my guest, I am at your service,my listener to the podcast or my viewer, or people that attendand an no will getto at the ofter show, which is a unique aspect of the show when you respectthem and their time everything flips on its head and one of the things that Ivery deliberately decided very early on was that I would never make the showabout myself. I would never do that. So my background is always somethingrelated to my guest. Sometimes it's their website. Sometimes it's theirclient list. Sometimes it's just you know Dr Harry Coand, O wrote a bookcould be the son of the salt. I had sunflowers because he talks about theheliotropic effect and you know that mindset shift is just a vital one. Alot of the you know I love being on your show today, because I get to likeyou know let verbal dirhea take over me, but one of the biggest shifts thathappened early on my wife. Actually, like said to me, you talk too much yourVobos. Your questions are too long. You don't listen and I change that veryquickly and now sometimes I'll just keep quiet until my guest is finished.If they talk for eight minutes, let them talk for eight minutes and then Iwill add something and something crazy happened. People started saying to meshow you such a good listener. You're the best listener that wey and I'm likewhat a Crock I'm the worst listener in the world, but just the ability to staysilent and listen. You know, God gave us two years, one mouth, let us usethat in direct proportion, that's how I've implemented customer experience orcustom obsession, because I've always...

...believed you know everythingcommunicates everyone communicates and custom experiences. The sum total ofevery interaction. In my case it starts with my guest. It continues with theaudience the community and it never stopped Ye H. it's really interesting.I just want to go all the way back to customer obsession where you started,which is th. The interesting thing about that to me is that you've movedupstream of customer experience. I think if you can culturally build anobsession in support of your customer, that a great experience is going to bethe natural outcome of it, and it's so funny I mean you, know oneof thethings,I've been thinking a lot about, and it's related to this idea that you justdo the right thing. You jump into conversation. You treat people ascommunity, which begs co creation and engagement, rather than I madesomething here, go consume it that we're going to you know createsomething together in the content is just part of that process. You've movedupstream of customer experience and let that become a natural outcome, asopposed to you know. So many of us think about it and approach ittraditionally, like we approach other projects and campaigns and things wewant to create and distribute, which is what do we want to make? How are wegoing to make it? How are we going to know that we've made it properly? Howdo we know that people like it iterate? You know that like that's the process,you know you know, fundamentally that translates into the fact that the showis alive and that people can comment and be on the show, and there are twoaspects to it, and you know it's. A sixty minute live, show every day, atwelve noon eastern standard time and then a thirty minute off to show on zoo,where you can actually interrect live with myself and the geft and actuallybecome part of the show and often oftentimes in that oftor show. I justput my mice on Mute and just let people talk, I don't need you know. I alwayssaid like, even when I wrote going back to again join the conversation I saidyou know, are you...

...life of the party? Are you party Pooperor your party Cressher? You know party animal like this whole idea like if you,if you throw a part, if you host a party, do you eaves, drop on all yourguests? Do you tell them what to talk about? Do you have to be a part ofevery conversation? Do you have to say? Okay, you know ethen and you know, and,and you know and John Welcome to my party. Let me give you a couple oftopics to talk about or d you just let them talk you know, and, and so that isthe offier show, but I feel like the way that you respect someone's time iswell, it's two things, one, it's recognition and valid, it's recognitionand validation and Su just the ability to say. Oh, look this one's here andand thank you for wishing me happy birthday or happy anniversary. It makesfor a very different show and one of the things I've been acutely aware of.As I you know, for me, Corona TV is the best of the old or the best of the new.So can I put on a professional show? Can I be a great interviewer? You knowaligned with Tim, Ferrison, Howardsten and format kin to beaulmor. Can Iexecute that, but still do that in a way that is completely fresh, original,innovative and respects who I am, which is born not born in, but but matured andgrowing through this social media world, and I believe the answer is yes, and bydoing that, I can create something that isn't the late show orthe tonight showor last week tonight, but something that will be unique original and a keyword which is differentiated, go back to the beginning, so go back toMarch thosand ad twenty and you know what was going on for you and when,like how long had the seed been planted for doing a show like this and thenwhat was the spark that was okay, I got...

I now's the time I got to do this sofirst of all, I've ought it's been a bucketlest item for me to have a showto be on it's not really about being on television, but I actually alwaysfundamentally felt that marketing customr experience, everything that wedo is so underrepresented on video and and specificallytelevision. You know this industry that is almost a trillion dollars globally.Right. Everything associated with marketing internal external Etca- wedon't have one show, there's not one show that actually exists on televisionto talk about it. There's there are some business channels like CNBC. Wehave Cheddar now, but no one really really is a voice for for creativity,for culture, for for marketing, rifle branding and- and maybe that's just theGeekin me because I really you know I Filip Cotlo in my show, I really reallylove the theory in the academic side. The historical side of my business, butalso believe marketing is fundamentally challenged right now and in manyrespects, broken in many places, but here's the story, Ind I'll, tell Itisas ucsinctly as I can. I'm in South Africa visiting my mom she's,thankfully doing well, but but it's almost five years into cancer, which hopefully will continue to be a chronicmanaged. You know disease and while I'm there I'm giving a presentation, I tryand double up while I'm there as well, and I've been going two to three timesa year, so traveling from the US. Thankfully, my family has been verysupportive for me to see her it's about. Ten minutes before I go on stage and myphone rings. I pick up the phone, it's my wife telling me she has coved.Imagine that ten minutes before this is March. Ten March elevent I fly out, getback the Landin in London switch on my phone, see. There's a travel ban inplace, go what the hell am I going to...

...get back realize? Yes, I am. I get back,I'm driving back to wastbort on e INE nety five. She was getting tested thatday in Greenwich she did have covid she's fine. Thankfully you know- and Iwas like realize- I was actually passing. Her got back immediately, wentand started self isolating on a different floor, different room in thehouse- and I don't remember the moment, but there was certainly no, let's starta show. I was like. Let me just go to facebook into a facebook live and tryAng make dear diary capture this moment. I have that first video, that's thebeauty of it. The next day I decided to do another one. The next week I wentactually for a covid test that were available. I was negative and I kind offacefook lived driving back from the test. The next week I started playingaround with zoom and experimenting sharing screen and doing a few thingsone week later. One week later, this is from March sixteent to March twenty.Seventh, I was talking to my sister, who is she lives in London, She's, anentrepreneur CIE as a spinning studio, they essentially told her. She had tolike stop doing in person classes, her quote Wase I'll, never forget it. Shesaid. I knew that if I close my dooras, I would close him for good, so shepivited a business put all her bikes in her in a Yeuhall, emailed customexperience, rike emalled, her best clients who wants Ta bike. Everyonewanted a Bo. I said why didn't you come on the show and and I'll interview youwho cares about nepotism? You've got a great story. She was guest number oneby the way she had covered at the time as well. So she had covered was, on myshow, guess number one, my sister, my wife, my mother, and here we are ahundred and eighty five episodes later, and on top of that, I left up a hugepart of this, which is the discovery of Streamyard, which is this platform.This piece of software has changed. My...

Life, zoom was not zoom was not thebest platform to do this live, but streamyord has changed my life, but Ijust want to say one ore thing. Every day my mother watches my show, andevery day my mother in law watches my show, and it's just been the mostbeautiful thing that a my mother says to me for the first time. I know whatyou do for a living, but second of all, how we've how the show is connected usthat every day she sees her son- and I can put a comment on screen doing himore my mom's watching, I hope you know so so what really happened even was. Therewas never a business plan. There was never a grand vision other than just do it other than put your headdown and figure it out and try something new and if it works, do moreof it and if it doesn't change cause, but soon enough. I realize that that Ihad something special and I would tell you just two little anecdotes. One is John Lawson facebook friend one day,I'm just looking at his live stream. Suddenly you know early on in thispandemic. A lot of people started streaming for some rea. You know likethit was stuck at home. What were they going to do, and I just reached out tohim and I'm like like dude like how did you do that? How did you do the pictureand picture and the crawl and the and the batter and the and guests like thisis awesome? I'm using zoom, I'm like like a doofis and Hi's like oh amusingstream, nod just the generosity I emailed them later. He thought I wascrazy. I said to him: Did you change my life? You changed my life by being asgenerous and heas like thanks, but I think you're a little crazy. You knowso. The other thing that happened was streamyard. Has An amazing communitythrough facebook right just to message board it wil well be to be to be bestpractice and one day just someone else who was on stream ID said: Hey, I'mshort of a guest. Anyone want to come...

...on my show. Well, I was on his showthat night and I heard one insight from another guest, which was, if you're notgoing to do this for two years, if you're not going to commit to streamingin particular for two years, come Hallo high water. No matter what stop now-and I said you know what I'm in I'm going to put my head down. I'm notgoing to worry about numbers, I'm not going to worry about metrix! I'm otgoing to worry about manatization everyone's going to ask me thosequestions, I'll answer them or I'll pushback. But for two years I am goingto perfect my craft and my formula annousus important love. What you do betrue to yourself and stay the course, and if you do surely good things willfollow and one more thing and then I will shut up, which is I ask everyone,this question, I'm going to ask it to you as well Joe Rogan, recently sold orsyndicated his show, the Jo Rogan experience to spotify right for, like ahundred and fifty million or something like it, how many episodes of the showdo you think he had done when he sold the show? Oh Gosh, I that's certainlyan Attriviw, a question that I'm well researched. I know that he sold hisshow. I mean I would guess, hundreds if not maybe twelve hundred so so the theonswers most people will guess three hundred four hundred you know, etc. Theanswer was: was around fifteen hundred, so I fel Yer II, guess well, you shouldyou should than you should also feel good about what you're doing as I amabout. You know a episode roughly about two hundred and anyone out there, likemy biggest advice to people out there right now is start it now, because in ayear's time you're going to wish you started it now today and guess what youknow. I am ahead of you guys because I started at march thirteen for Marchsixteent, but you know what there's place for all of us in this beautifulocean come on in the waters warm and that's the beauty of it right now. Ifyou actually love what you do or true...

...yourself and prepare to stay the caursefor two years I mean surely good things will follow, they have to it'sinevitable, yeah. I just want to recap a couple really key things you offeredthere, because I know some people have started shows and maybe have had fitsand starts on it. They didn't know what success should look like and they're,maybe looking at metrics and so maybe they're giving up before they evertruly start in earnest. These types of things, and so a couple things I heardfrom you there one is just starting. You know if there's been a ICH in you,have it again just start, because you started streaming on facebook now,you're on also streaming on Youtube and other places. I don't know all theplaces connect with other people, iteration learning growth, and I'mgoing to ask you specific question about that and just a moment you knowjoining Communities Finding out. Who Else is doing it? People are moregenerous than ever. I think you know you could have asked a I'm air, quotinghere for listeners, the wrong question the wrong person and they would havemaybe hoarded that information or ignored your question. But most peopleare willing to give I'm in a variety of communities where people r justoffering things as soon as people ask they come with. You know everythingthey've learned in a couple, additinal questions to tack on top and that's thewonderful thing about how we're living and I'll even tie it back to where wewere with guests earlier, which is the world's foremost experts on almost anytopic are available to us, either through produced pieces like videos andpodcasts and books, or through direct communication on social or through anyof the digital channels we communicate in, and so I really just wanted to echoyour get started. It will get better, don't worry so much about the details.The measurements et cet are going back to where we were right off. The top ofthe conversation like it has benefits in and of itself, and really I've seenit with this show too. You know, because I do pay attention to thenumbers. We are spending resources on it, and so I periodically like to givethe people that give me the blessing to...

...have these conversations, a publishthem. You know some updates that I know they can relate to. Besides the valuethat it provides me, I do internal education based on these conversations.Some of it turns into business there's so many benefits that aren't capturedin a listener or a download number on a podcast or a viewership number on ayoutube video or on a live stream and so set those things aside so and by theway I don't even want to you know like I'm, going to refrain from embarrassingyou too much in terms of saying how brilliant you are n what you do and howyou do it, but there are little suppleties as well. The cell is a softcell. You give you give before you ask before you before you personally, evenass back so they're little things like, and I see it even in the room right now,whether it's books at the back. You know, which are far enough back farenough, that I can't read them, but I'm assuming that they're yours arassociated with you, as opposed to being in my face right there. There isa there is a bombomb on the microphone. It's subtle, but ultimately yourproduct is an incredible incredible product, but you, you know, as the oldsaying goes, and this again came back from from one of my guests now, whichis people don't n, you know investors don't invest in ideas, they invest inpeople in people in relationships- and this is you know this was a subjectthat again, I came up in the last few days as well. Timferis Tim Ferris isthe example his book the four hour workweek the book, the book the bookwas rejected, Twenty five times and the twenty sixth time he said, I'm curiousto to the yes, he got. What is the reason that you said yes and they saidno reason, but I, like you and I feel, like you're Goinna, do everything inyour power with your last life breath...

...to make this a success. I mean ifpeople needed any more reason to be motivated there. I mean that just demonstrates that. Ultimately,this is a business about people and relationships. It's so funny like weall know this intuitively whent I get in these. You know what, like just hademe all lit up there, because I, like, I believe, all of it. I know all of it. Iknow all of it intuitively and yet- and I know everyone listening knows itintuitively going back to say yes because you never know what's going tohappen, say yes, because the conversation you're going to learnsomething something I say about hosting this podcast to echo, something yousaid probably fifteen minutes ago. This is I I regard. This is a master'sdegree that you cannot buy. I'm talking with people who are professionals withall kinds of, as you said, all kinds of perspectives, all kinds of backgrounds.I'm learning a ton in this- it doesn't exist anywhere else like I couldn't getthis anywhere else, and yet it's it's. It's timely, it's relevant and it'sfrom the source and so they're just and yet we're so afraid to do thingsthat we can't measure. I want to get back to the show a minute in particular,so I observe it as kind of a talk show. That's with produced, opens and closessegments like the sea that Soliloquy off the top. The after show, which youalready mentioned, which is much more casual and loose and interesting- it'snot more interesting. I mean it's interesting that it exists and it's atypically interesting conversations, especially because you just let them gotitles, graphics, lower thirds, which you mentioned shoutouts on people'sBirthdays, which I assume you're picking up on Linkedin and facebook,which make them highly available teases to upcoming guests and shows typicallywith like over the shoulder graphics. You know, as you mentioned, you changeyour backgrounds to reflect the topic of the show or the nature or thebackground of the guest live comments and callouts you're engaging with theaudienceas the show goes on. You can call them up with graphics, and so Ijust offer that to people who haven't seen the show which Yoseen the showwhich you can do by going to corona TV...

...that show and it redirects to youtubeand again it's live every day at new n Eastern Nine Pacific and talk to me a you already mentionedstreamyard and we don't need to get all into the weeds on it, because there aretons of blog posts on these types of things and communities. People can ask,but from that initial you know first, ten or twenty shows to what someonewould get if they watched it today. Just provide a couple highlights onthat iterative path for you as someone who is what basically producing thewhole thing yourself. You know, I would say the first guestwas was fundamental because a bringing on a guest and making itabout a guest by definition shows not about me anymore. Now. One might arguethat if I had made it about me, that would have been great. I probably wouldhave fifty virtual speaking gigs. You know lined up wo two thousand, antwenty one. At the moment I probably have zero. I don't even know. Maybe Ihave. Maybe I don't. I haven't changed my website. I haven't tried to becomethe world's greatest virtual speaker. I don't want to be a virtual speaker. Iwant to be a real speaker. I want to have real conversations. It took me ina different direction, and so I decided to put all of money to be to go all inon this format, so it didn't start off. As a talk show. I like the way you'reinterpreting and by the way everyone should interpret it the way they wantto and internalize it. Someone said it's a variety show for the modern era.I like that too. You know for me, it's all about. First, younever forget the first tride. You never forget the first time. So for me, Iloved the seated Sililoquy. I don't even remember when the first one is,but I'm going to go back and find it. I don't remember I'm slowly starting toorganize it and not tell you why in a moment, but now, okay, let me just stop thever a secondI'll talk about the seateds alitl wee.

Why does the seated Sililoquy Exist?Well, because most talk show hosts, have a monologue at the beginning,strytegically, it's the only time the show is about me. It's the only time,I'm certainly reminding people that I know a thing or two that I've written afew books that that I'm not just an interviewer but oftentimes like on this,like with you today, I'm the guest as well, but even the Soliloquy isactually not about me. So you know today I've Christina DJ, Coma, whodescribes herself. You know as a practical philosopher and she talksabout leadership, and so I'm talking about leadership over the next fouryears in the US- and I'm saying this is not a political post, but he has mythoughts about what she considers to be a great leader. So even the Soliloquyis is a hat tip to her and it becomes an ice breaker and if she's enthralledby it or or maybe she disagrees with it. The first thing is: She is going torespond by Tdeng by the way in your soliloquy there's a couple of thingsthat take issue with or there's something you said that made me thinkBlah Blah Blah. So already I've created a bridge, but there's one final thingand the point I'm trying to make yeah is oftentimes, execut execution,actually trump's strategy, which is the most heretical thing. I'veever said in my life, you've cedtainly Ei sit heradical things relative to theSES waned Awayas as the most because I'm a strategist. You know I'm, that ismy whole life and I'm sometimes just doing it is so much better thanoverthinking it it's when you know this came from one of my guests as well gutand intuition trumps. You know the brain talking you out of an idea andoverthinking and creating dowbt, but...

...here's the Soliloquy I turne around,and I said you know everyone's publishing books and putting books out,and I need to think about a book and you know- and I but more importantly Ihaven't been writing. I need to write and someone as like Joe do you realizethat, like you have maybe three boks, if you just took your seatedsoliloquies and publishd them every day, three hundred and fifty to four hundredwords that are a commentary on the times we living in on things that arehappening in the world. In the news you're related to your guest thingsabout generosity, grit, adversity, failure, you know, optimism, leadership, etc. So the firstare amazing and one more first, I have to mention new years Treaman ev rightwho needs Ryan Sea Crest, who needs Anderson, Cooper and andycone. I did atwo hour live stream with musical performances with guests. You knowdialing in the New Year you know my wife even came on camera. An gave me akiss at midnight. I had my planet, fitness hat. I even basically said Imay plan and fitness to sponsor, even though they actually weren't thesponsor. You know like who cares like what are they going to do suny afterthe fact, but by doing that, I'm showing what I'm showing potentialsponsors out there, what it might look like, and so the first are the things that Icelebrate and, as I said when you you know, I was so jazz by this news.Streaman Eve. Why? Because I created a new usecase for myself a new use case,saying I can do big events special occasions. I hadn'tthought about it until just now, super bowl could do the super bowl. Why? Not?You know? Have people come on? You know jump on Jum, O juckle. We even did thefirst night of the RNC, which actually was was. Was it not great? Just becauselike it was just, it was just too...

...chaotic and it wasn't coordinatedenough as well. But you know experimentation is the order of the day,and so you know the evolution of it is as such that when something works domore of it when it doesn't work. Okay well, but I want to add somethingthereis, a very important point: I'm going to contradict myself very quickly,which is just because it doesn't work today, doesn't mean it won't worktomorrow and just because a word today doesn't mean Er. What it will worktomorrow, remember that for people that are out there, starting don't give upon something prematurely, keep mixing it up and be very, very sure whenyou've determined that it's not working where you're going to kind of you knowchange course, because you just might not have given it enough time, and thatis the art of being an entrepreneurn. That is the art of being a host right,which is half the time you're going to have listen to people's advice and takeit to Hart, especially if you trust them and respect them and half the time,be true to yourself and stay the course. So that's kind of how it is evolved.There is one more thing that I probably should mention. The zoom of Te showright, which may be gaited at some point. I might go to Patreon and mighttell people hey, listen it's available to O for five bucks, but what hashappened? That's more important than that. Is that what I've realized is thepower of communal conversation. So one of the things that I started was I wentto my zoom of to show people initially, and I said why didn't you all come on ashow, but that is created what I call corona community. So every Friday nowis a show with five of my previous guests. So I've got two hundred guests,let's say by the end of January. Well, what happens when you have David Maymon,Scott and Mark Shafer on the same show which we did or Bruce Choqel Mitchjoland mark chaffer on one show which we...

...did already what happens when you startto bring all of these people together and now have six of us on stage at thesame time. So all of this has just come through this process of openingyourself up to the universe. You know to being able to say, have a formathave a structure that is fixed but not permanent. If you will, you know thatis structured, but not so structured that you can't adapt and change andmorphid overtime, so good to two observations. I want to make or thingsthat you've mentioned that I want to reinforce. The first is related to notgiving up too soon, which is an echo of the two year commitment or the fifteenhundred show rogan episodes, except on a more micro scale, something you'redoing within the structure. Don't give up on it until you have some criteriathat you've defined to say that this is working where this isn't working orneeds to be adjusted. It is a completely an itrative process, likealmost everything that we do in our lives. The other thing I want to saythat that really like about the after show in particular in the way that youthought about it, is that you know so much of the customer experience.Conversation is about company to customer, or you know, employee, tocustomer or customer to employee or customer to company Your brand, and notenough of it is about customer to customer in a community sense and howmuch can be learned by customers in conversation with each other, not evenincluding the brand or the company or an employee. You don't need tosupervise it. You don't need to guide it you just let it happen. You may noteven know what they're talking about, and they may not be talking about youpositively, but there's so much benefit to letting customers talk to customersand creating spaces and reasons and opportunities for people to do that.Two ore, quick questions about Corona TV. I said quick. I don't know thatthey're going to be, but I would love just for you know...

...for the folks who listen to this sor,it's a Tronfort epited. What you're saying to me is Joe answer them quickly.Well, I don't know I don't know. I want you to answer them in a well try. Iwill try. That's honest your experience. You know whether it's whether it's live,synchronous, video, like you and I- are conversing over zoom and then we'llrelease it release the recording of it by the way. If you want to see thatplanet fitness had or clipse of this conversation, we we trimm this up andpost them at Bombomcom podcast. We do short writeups of all of them. Wou dofive or six video clips. Of course you have the full ambedded audio. We have anew audio player there that you can search for specific phrases. So, ifYou'e ever listening to an episode like this one and you're like Oh, my gosh, Iwant to go back to that moment where he talked about availability, and I don'tremember the availability heuristic, you can go to the player at Bombamcom,H, podcast and this one is a course episode, Hundre, a twenty five insearch, availability, heuristic or availability. An will find it in that,and you can listen to that section over again so anyway, because people areengaged in live. Conversations like we are. A lot of people are recording andsending video messages, and these types of things I would love for you toprovide a little bit of guidance specific to being on camera. Do you doanything in particular to make it engaging for your viewers? Are youconscious about any of that or have any have any of your behavior changes cometo mind in the way that you can engage viewers while you are on camera and ordo you do anything particular to make it engaging for your guests like whatare you doing consciously, whether it's with your body or your voice or youreye contact or anything else? What are you doing to make it engaging forvewers and what are you doing to make it engaging for your guests? So Wow?That's there's a lot to think about, because alot of it is instinctive, an and natural, so so not to overthink. I'll.Tell you. One of the best things for me is is that my wife listens to everyshow. You know, and she gives me really...

...good feet back now. I tell her I pushedback and I could really you know angry with all the time, but I know- and sheknows that she's right about everything so as she always its, she knows you aswell as anybody, but she tells me like she tells me sometimes what she doesn'tlike is. Sometimes I get too buddy buddy with my buddies. So you know Imight be reminiscing with someone that I haven't seen in ten years, but itgets to esoteric so by by engaging with the guest too much, I'm alienating andisolating the audience, the community and VICAVERSA. If I bring on you knowand and O look at Steve and it's Tom and it's joy and Bob says this and Bobsays that then at some point it gets to esateric on few active commenters side.So balance is key. You know I I'm up for anything, I'm gaing for anything,so I'll sink Karaoke with a guest I'll. You know I had a live tero reading. You know theability to Dison your guest is important or more important. I shouldsay to make him feel comfortable and at home, and the best way to do it is youknow, to smile right into and to pay hmma compliment and to thank them. Imean these are, and I don't do any of that. grituitiously, like one thing Ifound is, is I really really get joy in really flattering my guest reallyflattering them with what I think is deserved. You know praise becausepeople, don't people don't do that enough. It's so easy. Just to tellsomeone that you, you know that you appreciate them or that you love them,or you know when you, when I have guests on the show, like you know,Marsha Anglebird it toks about the IMORI effect, all about love, the powerof love, it's liberating as well. So there are little things you know andhad tips. I think when, when people for...

...example, let's get practical, ifsomebody comments seventeen comments and you don't put them on screen-that's that's. That's not a good feeling. Right, I will be on shows I'll,see, shows streaming and I look on facebook ind. It says, like four peopleare on. I don't care, but when I say hig there and it goes oh look JosephJaffe said hi, I feel like a million bucks. I feel like a million bucks,because because someone said my name, someone acknowledged me as opposed toOh, my God. I just got mentioned on a show. With a million people who cares,you know you got to reduce it down to its simplest component, part which isconnection so it's connection, connection connection connection acrossthe board, genuine authentic. You know connection because, as the old sayinggoes, I don't know if it can. I swear a little but not sure. Well, I I've got acouple emarks on some of the episodes yeah. Well, I mean well so that youdon't have to put an email, but you can't bowl. You know something a bull,something you know yeah. So it's like we are. If we can strip out all the barriersbetween us, something that Davered meman Scott said is right now you and Iwere four feet apart- were actually about four feet apart. If we reachedout right now, we could touch each other ight. We could give each other,we could technically shaw cans or give each other a Huad. That's how close woare. So there is an intimacy associated with this idea of within streaming, and I think that'swhy maybe we're seeing so much of a grow right now, and people that arewatching feel that we are that close to them as well. So if you visualize thatspace and you respect that space, it's a very powerful, powerful connectionthat can result and at scale right one to many yeah, so many good things there.I think the sincerity is really really key. This idea that that you take greatpleasure in flattering people but...

...qualifier. It has to be sincere or else,and I think we can tell the difference. Your viewers can tell the difference inyour guests can tell the differences so when it's sincere, there's nothingbetter and you're. Absolutely right! None of us! You know despite gratitudejournaling, and you know how many books have been written over the past severalcenturies about. You know, compliments and saying. Thank you. It's the kind ofthing that, if your parent did well that you're trained to do, but stillnone of us does it enough, and I, like the extra layer you that would that Iinferred from what you said there, which is. I appreciate you because Ilove you, because if you just provide n a like a little bit additional reason,it's so much different than cheers, or thank you with the end of an email thatwe all see. You know so often that it's almost meaningless. It is differentwhen someone looks you in the iyeand says. Thank you. I really reallyappreciate what you did, but if you can add that because and make it trulypersonal to them makes someone's Day even the mosthardcore Badass type, a people that we know are desperate for what you aretalking about, which is this need to be seen and heard and understood and anappreciated as an individual human being so much good stuff here and bythe way I'll tell you very quickly. Every day after the show ends, I send athank you email to my guest. I could probably count on one hand the amountthat Hav beaten me to it by thanking me before, because I do it that quickly,that's not a slihe, I do it really quickly. I did within fifteen twentyminutes of the after show ending in the email is the because right. I say thatthe subject is thank you and then I say something very personal associated withwith the show and with them being on the show. And then I go here thedownload links, and should you wish to promote a Hera, some links and her thefiles, the file that you can cut up and slice and dice and use for your ownpurposes? That's important not to promote me or my show, or even yourappearance on the show, but if there's...

...a real, great sound bite that makes youlook good, put that into your reel or use that sometimes it's just you oncamera and then at the bottom and if you'd like to recommend any guests,just ask right: oftentimes, they won't even get to the bottom of the email,but they might and go. Oh, you should have this person on your show, so Ilove what you I'm doing it back to you now right. I love the because if you onmy show right now- and this was the interview I would have captured, thatmoment is what I call the corona bite, which is a sixty second highlight ofthe show, and I would call the highlight thecause doctor doter causeit's the because, if you've taken the time to thank them, that's eightypercent of the battle, but if you aready ready, want to got a clock thator hit that home run on Sir the dotor dock, because yeah it's the kind ofthing that people will remember later in the day or later in the week orlater in the month I mean it, creates this residual value because it happensso infrequently even again for people who get a lot of attention. Let's goreally really high level for just a minute. You know you wrote life afterthe thirty second spot. I think it was your first book you came out oftraditional advertising, you're very familiar with television. SMI spent adozen years running marketing inside local TV stations. You were one of thepeople among several the people I mentioned off the top that you've hadon Corona TV who guided me through your early publishing, online and books tosee the transition to digital in general, andto, social in particular,and you know to this fragmentation. This idea that you know it anyway. Thekind of the breakdown of a lot of the the business model around traditionalbroadcast and I ended up writing a blog post about five and a half years ago,called the shiny authenticity and version, and it was this idea that youknow back in the day. If you ran television ads, you immediately gottrust because, if you're a legitimate enough big enough big budget enoughbusiness to be able to run ads on television, it must be legitimate. Youknow like so it was. It was trustworthy...

...to be able to spend that kind of money.And now you know these big brands are doing the reverse: they're coming downmarket toward us, they're doing just kind of airecording your crappierphotos and videos in order to become what we are now as publishers, which ismore authentic, more there's, no there's no mistaking the authenticityand genuine nature of who you are and what you're doing and yet you'reequipped with these much more powerful tools that are much less expensive thanever before, from the cameras to streamyard and the switching betweensources and bringing up graphics and all these things that need to require acontrol room like the Gr, like the monitors behind you, you know in atraditional kind of bid and my life just and my light just broke before westarted as well like Ihave, one lamp that I don't know points up to the tothe ceiling. But you know you talk to talk to me about this inversion likethis idea of our ability to do this ind the way thatis coming together, the way that maybe the pandemic evenforced, you knowreporters on national and international television to be. You know broadcastingfrom their homes and so now there's this parody between the multibilliondollar brands and you as a solo guy, is like it's so much closer than ever.Just talk about maybe the implications or why that is or any thoughts you haveabout it, yeah, no totally so Richard Owen, who actually is he used to be theC of Sathmetrics, which was the company that that was behind the nedpromoterscholl and he's a good friend he was on the show and it was in the offter showand he I never forget, thes sound bite. He basically said the amazing thing,that's happening, is you guys you and all the fellow streames? As I call them,you guys are just raising your game and raising the bar and getting better andbetter and better. But on the flip side, you've got, I mean he said: You've gotall you've got the falons and you've got. You know. You've got all of thesetraditional personalities and brands.

He's he's. I think prays weredescending into wanes world and being shown up for their awkwardness and not and not necessarilyin a good way. So he was basically talking about a leveling of the playingfields, but ultimately their momentum was not growing, whereas ours is nowI'm not taking t at as a you know, self, congratulatory or or Selfimportance,but it's a fundamental change, which is we're moving forward and getting betterand better at what we do they're in a way going through a massive transition.Will we go back to the live, show audience and the canned laughter youknow and and t e overproduced stick. You know, will that be authentic? Willthat be what the audience wants and needs and response to, and my feelingis yeah of course, ther'll there'll be a place for everyone, but that's thedifference and I think you nailed it as well, which is recognizing that I mean.I don't think this is even conjecture. I don't think any of them will say. Ithink the way that we did it a during Covid, the worst of Covid, is how weshould be doing it when things get back to normal. They cannot wait to get backto normal, but what is normal anymore, normal, isn't overproduced andcontrolled anymore. Normal is Watan all flaws. I look this my green screen.Mell functioned. I am just like you, you are just like me, so I think that'sthat's. It's so astute what what what you'retalking about and that's why I think people should realize that this is theway life is. This is a an analogy that is perfect for life,the barriers to entry on nonexistent, but to actually grow it and scale itand make it that's hard. That's really really hard. So this is a marathon oran ultra Merathan or an extreme...

...ultramarathan, not as print, butanybody can just do it. Anybody can just you know, you don't even needchoose if you could just bearfoot start to run to use that analogy, but overtime, if you really want to be a world beater, you got to put in your tenthousand hours and you have to raise your game, but the good news is that Ithink momentum is on our side and I'll just say one more thing, which is youknow I I want to in two thousand and twentyone which we're in right now develop a new presentation, probably write a newbook, maybe even develop a training program or a workshop simply called howI reinvented myself during a global pandemic and Oucan to and the goal isto you know, hold nothing back. Every single titooll trick software hardwayin a box just be able to deliver it tactically, but strategically andconceptually from a motivational standpoint, just walk people. You knowsomeone said this to me the other day they said everyone is talking aboutpivoting and how they need to pivot. And the word the marketing word of theyear in two thousand and twenty was pervere. You did it. You've done ityou're continuing to do it. I want to tell that story to people, and one ofthe pivots by the way is that the name of the show will change so my deadlineto change the name is the one, your anniversary, but, as someone said to methe other day they said I mean it was just a very you know very cress or notcrest, but you know just very stop point. They said it's like calling yourshow: Nine Leven TV. You Know Corona TV and I was like Bat, a corona, it's abeer, it's a crown. It's like they like, and I went and search for the wodcorona on Google. I didn't see anything about rings of light and Rigt or evenbeer. So so that's another pivot right,...

...which is not getting so attached to aname or even a format that I can't detach and let it go yas so good youcould. You could always fall back to where you were a dozen years ago. When you started onYoutube, is I think it was Jaffy Juice, TV? Okay. So this has been awesome. Igot to let you go because you have a o show. You have a live, showed up puttogether, but folks were listening. You know we obviously went a little bitlong on this one and so you've obviously enjoyed your time with Joseph.You would also love episode for which we mentioned off the top. Is Yourcompany built to last or built to suck episode for the Customer ExperiencePodcast few others with mutual guests of ours episodes sixty of this showwith Matt Sweezie the Context Marketing Revolution episode? Sixty three, youmentioned David Merman Scott. We talked about Fandom, we talked about humanconnection. We talked about video, an that psychological connection, builttwo feet away from the camera, which is four feet away from each other, whichis within social distance to bond with other humans, even through cameras andmore recently episode Hunde and twenty two with Brittny hodack about superfans and building super fandom. Before I let you go, could you give a mentionto a person? Who's had a positive impact on your life for your career andt accompany your brand that you respect for the experience they deliver for youas a customer. So no because I want to say three things quickly to you and one is. I love how you said you talkabout respecting your viewer. You just did that by saying you're, obviouslyenjoying this interview, because you're if people are so watching at this point,they clearly are enjoying it. So I love how you you know you didn't, do it in aselfdeprocading way, which is well if you're, you know a masachist and stillwatching at this point. You know you didn't apologize. You just said well,you know you're here because you want to be here, so I like that. The secondthing is, I would tell people, but I'm going to do it as well, I'm going to goback and watch episode for because I want to see how I've changed betweenfour on hundred and twenty five, I want...

...to see how promotional or selfpromotional I was. I just want to see t that's the beauty of video. Youactually have this live. You know, accounting of your life. That's that's!Why Thet! You know they call. It live streaming, but Ito, it's alsolifestreaming. So that's a second point that I wanted to make as well now onthird point liltup for people in Zoom. This also came through my show. There'sa thing called self few: Take it off! So I'm not looking at myself right now,I'm only looking at you so hide sellfor you when you're on zoom and that's agreat way as well just to focus on the person you're talking to and be muchmore present. So you know people and companies. I mean it's very, verysimple. When it comes to people and it's not gratudous, it's you it's allof my guists, it's my community, it's IAM shaped by and I'm part of you know.I always said this that that the big problem even enjoying the conversation,the brand, doesn't live in the middle. I don't live in the Mor. No one livesin the world. Nothing is in the middle, we're just part of this liquid. YouKnow Malleyable, you know blob that keeps shifting and changing, and it'snot about you know the sun is in the middle and everyone revolves around itas well, but I also recognize my role in that and so iam eternally gratefulfor this opportunity to come back on your show Iam. I really really. I havegrown so much and learned so much from each and every gets even the bad. Thebad shows you need bad shows because otherwise, how would you know what agood show is and in terms of you know, companies out there I mean I could giveyou a I'm still a marketer at the end of theday and we've seen so many marketers just lose their way and brands losetheir way and just you know, just absolutely come out with tone. Diffmessaging, but Nike has always been a company close to me an my heart. Ireaber saying I wanted to dedicate one...

...of my books by saying to Nike becauseof the mantra just do it. My Ami and Wiley said they nixed it because t Eysaid it was too promotional. I said they're not paying for it. I just youknow. Even you know when we came through so much of the stress and thestrain of this yoar. You know going through a lot of unrest and you knowthere was only company that could come out with a message and be true tothemselves and talk about the power of not just uniting and uniting throughdifferences, but also you know, kind of embracing that diversity and, quitefrankly, the role that Sportas always played to bring people together. Sothat would be mianso awesome. If people want to follow up on this, where wouldyou send them? I don't ever know anymore. I guess so.You could follow me on Pelaton. I just got a pellaton bike, so I'll do videochat with people that that's my new thing is doing videochat with people,while I'm like dying on the bike, I'm still at Jeffy juice, on on all thesocials, and you know every day the show is live or twelve on facebookyoutube, linkedin periscope, which is closing down, but will be twitter. Iguess again so live on those four platforms and yeah. I would I wouldlove if people would subscribe to the show on my youtube channel, CoroniTVDOT show and if they are so inclined, I do a weekly newsletter, which is nowcompletely aligned with the show. So what I do is I preview the coming weeks. Guess Iactually give links to all the show the previous week shows with a littlesynopsis and the Corona Bite, and then I provide all of the the I provide thecorona question. That's a new thing, so I ask all my guests the same coronaquestion I stitch Thar together and then all of my seated sililoquies andif you're in North America just text the word Corona TV to six six, eightsix six and subscribe to the newserter. So that's, that's me! THAT'S YOU FORDOB!Thank you for the opportunity to...

...promote the show. Yeah you're welcomeBA again it. As I said before, and is you were kind enough to point out ifsomeone's listening right now they really enjoyed this. You don't you Oyou'll, keep listening if you're, not if you're not engageing, so I thinkureexactly. I love ot it and if you start a show, if you're listening right now-and you start a show- and you want me to come on the answers- yes awesome,just just mention that you saw me on this- show today awesome. I will linkall this up. As I mentioned, Bombomcom podcast video clips, all of the socialreferences, the link to Corona TV and the details on texting which I'll haveto watch the the recording in order to type up into the blog post. It's CoronaTV, tosixix, eight, six, six, yeah yeah, see okay, I'm pretty good all right!Thank you! So much I bid you a great rest. Either Your Day continued successon the route to two years. I look forward to what you'll be doing sixmonths and twelve months from now. I really enjoyed it and I'm glad we coulddo it and thank you I love being on the show. Any time you want me back, I willbe back. Awesome sounds good, clear, communication, human connection, higherconversion. These are just some of the benefits of adding video to themessages your sending every day. It's easy to do with just a little guidance,so pick up the official book rehumonize Your Business, how personal videos,accelerate sales and improve customer experience learn more in order today atBombam Fcom Boock, that's bomb vombcom fuck, thanks for listening to thecustomer experience. podcast remember the single most important thing you cando today is to create and deliver a better experience for your customers,continue learning the latest strategies and tactics by subscribing right now inyour favorite podcast player, or visit Bombomcom podcast.

In-Stream Audio Search

NEW

Search across all episodes within this podcast

Episodes (161)