The Customer Experience Podcast
The Customer Experience Podcast

Episode · 1 month ago

162. The Shared Belief Behind Human-Centered Communication w/ Steve Pacinelli

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

No one individual has all the answers to everything. With a concept as broad yet essential as human-centered communication, it was going to take many experts — 11, to be exact — to begin to equip us with the knowledge we need to recenter our communication around people. 

In this episode, I have the pleasure of chatting with my longtime friend and two-time coauthor, Steve Pacinelli, CMO at BombBomb, about what he learned from the process of writing our book, Human-Centered Communication.  

Join us as we discuss:

  • Why customer experience is built on the exploration of a shared belief
  • Where the idea for the book originated
  • What the big idea behind human-centered communication is
  • Who each expert is and what you can expect in each of their chapters
  • What interactive experiences we created around the book

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Human Center communication, it comesdown to having sound messaging sound communication. It comes down to puttingthe needs once an interest of your recipient on equal level playing fieldas your own and then delivering it in the best possible medium to make thatconnection. The single most important thing you cando today is to create and deliver a better experience for your customers,learn how sales marketing and customer success experts create internalalignment, achieve desired outcomes and exceed customer expectations in apersonal and human way. This is the customer experience podcast. Here'syour host, Eth and Bute to day's guest is a long time friend and long time.Team, member he's the chief marketing officer at Bomba and together wecoothered two books. The first is rehumanize your business, how personalvideos accelerate sales and improve customer experience that was releasedby Wiley about two years ago and the brand new one is human centeredcommunication, a business case against digital pollution. This one releases onfast company press next week for those who you listening later, that's October,twelve, two thousand and twenty one. He joined us back on episode. Six of thispodcast, connecting with customers by exploring a shared belief and for thepast couple of months, he's Co, hosted this podcast with me to day he's theguest again because human center communication has such a big impact onCX, Steve Passini. Welcome back to the customer experience podcast, I'm soglad that you invited me back after our Dole hosting or co hosting adventurethat we just had over the past several weeks. Yeah it was so I enjoyed it. Igot some good unsolicited listener feedback, which is awesome. It justkind of switches it up. It's interesting. The podcast is what twoand a half years old or something and it made sense it was fun. I enjoyed itand the thing that I really enjoy working with you on things like thebook, all the things we work on, but things like the book and things likethese podcast episodes that you invest so much in them. Just like you, investa lot into yourself, you're constantly looking to learn and grow. Well, thanksman, I enjoy the time with you as well right back at you cool, so we're goingto talk a little bit about some of those episodes in some of thoseconversations see what we remember about them, but we're going to startwhere we always start, which is customer experience when I say customerexperience. What does that mean to you? You know I knew you're going to askthis, of course- and I remember my answer from last time and I still I gotto double down on that answer now. The exploration of a shared belief doesn'tnecessarily mean it's a good customer experience. I'm not commenting on thequality of the customer experience, but overall, that's that's what I feel itis from the moment that they see your website. You know the experience thatthey have with your website or through a conversation with a friend. It startsthat that experience of do they believe in the problem that you are solving. Dothey believe that you're the one to solve it for them and when they talk toyour people, when they look at you, your APP if you're selling it apper, ifyou're sending a service from you know when they've been customers for fiveyears? Do they still hold that belief? Is it strong? So I'm still going todouble down on that, but you know what I've learned over the past couple ofyears, though, is this is kind of embarrassing to say, but I didn'tunderstand the depth in which everything is customer experience.Every single action within a company ultimately leads to the customerexperience from the policies that the that the leadership team makes an HRmakes to you know it could be the vacation policy. A vacation policy canaffect the customer experience because you're affecting the customer from youknow any position from the person...

...working on your website to the personcrafting the messages to the product. It all goes back to that customerexperience and honestly, a couple years ago, like I knew that was the case, butevery day that passes, it becomes more and more clear that every single actionall leads to the customer. If you're doing it right yeah. It's reallyinteresting. I mean what you, obviously, that theme of employee experience andemployee engagement directly affecting customer experience like a necessaryfoundational consideration even prior to thinking about moments that matterand touch points and how we're going to improve things and where we're going toremove friction and all the other kind of mechanics of customer experienceunderneath all of it to your point is, of course, employee experience and just hearing the way you talked aboutthat really push that even broader and deeper. And it's it's this. You knowit's just like what it's like to be with a healthy person Rightt. So youknow: We've had long time, friends or family members or whatever and at somepoint in their life they weren't quite as healthy in some way, whether it bephysical, psychological, emotional, whatever and other points they're justdoing great, and it's that same thing when people interact with the companyif what's going on inside, is aligned and healthy and good, it's going tofeel different and it's going to leave a different impression in residence.Then, if it's unhealthy and a little bit broken or disjointed, or you knowthat sales rep doesn't feel supported by a manager and so they're having it,you know a bad week or a head month or that the customer care team is, youknow, doing incredibly well like great response time and really good, employengagement and they're feeling like great camaraderie, like that's, goingto be a good spell for any of the touch points during that period. So that'sreally interesting. If the manager isn't going to care about that customercare employee than the customer care employee is less likely to care aboutthe customer, absolutely yeah. It's funny. I'm reading right now to booksand actually both of these folks, one of them we interviewed together and I'mabout to interview and we'll release shortly. This conversation with DanGingiss, I just read: albe back from Shep Hiken, followed by the experiencemaker from Dan Gingiss, and it so of just like all these things.Themes are super hot for me, so we won't get into those yet, but we willtalk Shep a little bit later before we go forward Steve I'm going to because Idon't know I an. I think. People know at this point that that I am a bom bombteam member and that I'm hosting the show on behalf of Bom Bom. I think ourlogo might be on the little tile, that's in spotify and apple podcast andall the other spots. But I've never addressed this myself and I don't thinkthat I asked you the first time on the show, and I don't think that I asked Ithink Jonathan Bolton, our chief customer officer, has been on the showDarren Dawson, our co, founder and president has been on the show, but Idon't know that I've asked this question, so I'm going to ask it of youfor folks who are listening, who may be curious to hear a little bit more forpeople who are familiar. Tell us a little bit about Bombon. Who is, Iguess I'll, say it as ours who's our ideal customer an what problem orproblems do we solve for them yeah? Well, Bob Am, I is a company at itscore. Besides the you know, the product that that we sell, like I feel like thepeople at Bomba, want sincerely to help people be the best their best selves.You know they they want to get our customers in front of their customersmore often, and so obviously you know on a simplistic level, we sell aplatform that allows people to record themselves and get in front of theirprospects, their customers, the people that matter most in a video platform-and you know that's that's primarily what the product is. Now we have someexciting things that you know that we're working on for the future, whichmay shift that, quite you know quite a...

...bit, but that's what we do right nowand and our primary customer is the company or the person it could be asolar preneur that believes that their people are their best assets and if youbelieve you hired an amazing group of folks but the technology, that's outthere, the tools that we use to communicate with each other the mostover through you know, email or Linkedin, messenger or text messagingor social. If you believe that that your people would be better if theywere seen and heard, that is our primary customer, that is who wouldbenefit the most because you hire your sales folks, you hire the people onyour team because they connected with you. How can they connect with yourcustomers or future customers if they're not seen and heard, if you onlyhave a quick snip at a time on a on a zoom call or or a meeting, you know a aWeber type meeting where people can actually see you if you're limited tothat small amount of time. You are you really using your people as well as asyou could, and are they being them their best cells as well yeah, I loveit. You went to a share belief with that one and we could get technicallyinto like you know, sales teams, you know the different roles than a salesteam or a customer success, team leadership and management. All thedifferent use cases across the customer life cycle across the employee lifecycle. There's so many things we could do there, but I agree with you that itcomes down to that shared belief of am I better in person? Are My peoplebetter in person? Are My people, my best asset? Will our prospects orcustomers or other people feel seen and heard themselves if we reach out in amore personal and human way, and I think if you share some of that belieffor you're curious enough to pursue it, which is some of the language that youused in our first conversation on the show, then we have a really interestingand helpful conversation for you and by the way and iteresting and helpfulproduct and service and approach to training and developing your ability toappear on camera and to offer the right messages to the right people when tosend video and not to send video and all of that and a more simplisticanswer to your question. Maybe I went to too far out there, but you know if,if you have a product, that's that's highly commoditized. If you are in anindustry, that's highly competitive. You know that relies on relationship.If you have a healthy team culture, that's another, you know element likeall those things. If you add those things together, then our productsgoing to be perfect for you, because it's going to help you stand out, it'sgoing to help, get your people in front of those people and do what they dobest awesome. I want to get into the bookand the podcast series that we co hosted here on the customer experiencepodcast and talk about those folks before you do I'll. Just add. If youare listening to this- and you have tried video before or your team hastried video before and you felt like this doesn't work for us. We also havea really good conversation to have with you, Steve and I've been workingtogether side by side for almost seven years now the company go to market. Youknow the actual generating retaining expanding, servinghelping customers we've been doing for a decade as a company, and we havehelped all kinds of folks who've been through, maybe one of those one of theproducts or services that doesn't come with any guidance or training andtherefore you're kind of left to your own. That's another thing that wespecialize in here. We know that you're better in person and- and we want tohelp you do that anything to add that Steve. No, I think I think you did awonderful job as yeah. I just feel I just feel like so many people like Itried that I'm like you, are not thinking about this opportunity. Theright way. I think it was. Usually people aren't thinking broad enoughthey're thinking about the particular use case. They use it as a novelty orthey think that just you, just the...

...video is going to help and that's notthe that's, not the answer. You can put a video out there and if you have acrappy message, you're still going to have a crappy result. You need to havea sound message is what we talk about a lot in the book and Human Center, acommunication. It comes down to having sound messaging, sound communication.It comes down to putting the needs once an interest of your recipient on equallevel playing field as your own and then delivering it in the best possiblemedium to make that connection, and when you add all those things together,then you'll have a unstoppable sales force, an unstoppable team, that'sconnecting digitally, which is hard to do really good. I'm glad I gave it backto you, because you did a really nice job. teeing up Human CenterCommunication Now for folks are listening, Steve and I again we co offto rehumanize your business together a couple of years ago and since that timea it's been a pleasure to have people reach out who are getting value fromthat message and like bile, truly building a sense of community simply byvirtue of putting these ideas into a tangible format that reaches beyondwhatever our digital reaches. There's something interesting about working inthe analog format. I know you and I both read a lot of books. We have kindof a bias toward that anyway, but you know: We've playfully gone back andforth on Ha got an idea for another book and you know sometimes thereactions like too soon too soon, but but when you have the you had the ideafor this one before we get into the people who we invited into thisconversation, to bring these ideas to life and to provide a lot of teachingand perspectives. Far Beyond our own, to the degree you can go back to theinitial spark lay. What was your motivation to say? I got an idea and Iwant to talk to ethon about this. Oh God, I think you actually alreadymentioned it, because the knowledge and the insight that wedo not have was the spark for for this idea. It'slike T Y we've been doing this for a long, long time and Bombombay businesssince two thousand and six you've been with the company since two thousand a Dand eleven right, two thousand and eleven yep and I've been a customersince two thousand and twelve or two thousand and eleven to two thousand andfifteen and then with the bomb bomb team and E. knowing that we've beendoing this for such a long time, I'm still acutely aware that that Idon't have all the answers and you don't have all of the answers and justthinking about the smart people. Really it was thinking about your podcast,your Po. I don't know if we ever talked about this, but as I thought about youand all the smart people that you interview on your podcast and all thethings that I learned through the years listening to you working out in themorning and listening to the people on your podcast, I'm like you. This isawesome and that whole podcast of interviewing someone else the wholeconcept weekend and week out. I. Why wouldn't that work in a book like?Why do we expect one author or two authors to have all of the answers? Andthat's what really got me just thinking about bringing in the smartest peoplethat we know and then that's why? I love about the book and the finishedand the final product. There are so many diverse perspectives and points ofview and we'll get into it as we start talking about the the individuals thatwe simply do not possess, but they do and it came into one cohesive storythat I'm just I'm so proud of. I mean you do amazing work you know. Obviously,Ethan is the one that actually sits down after we get together and- and wedo the interviews and we talk about the structure. Ethan sits down and putswords to paper, and he just has an amazing amazing ability to take allthese different perspectives and thoughts and turn it into something.That's magic and you know not to disparage rehumanize your business inany way, but this book it stomps it wow.

Okay. First, thank you. That's reallykind. Second, super provocative. We could spend ten minutes just peelingthat apart, but I'll go out and assume that most listeners have not read thatbook, so probably wouldn't entertain them or be as much use as as much as itwould be fun for you and me to do which so maybe we'll do it offline, but yeah. I I absolutely and just goingback to that theme that you offered off the top. You know the reason we invitedthese people in was shared belief. These people, not all of them, sendvideo messages, but most of them do. Of course everyone is on video calls andvirtual presentations, and everyone sends email and linked in messages andall these other things that we need to do a lot of unique experiences inperspectives. A lot of sales professional, never mind we'll just getinto it. We we'll just get into it. So we'll dothis kind of is a little bit of a speed round, because we have eleven expertsthat we brought in I'm going to mention them by the way in order of theirappearance here on the customer experience podcast, so chapters threethrough thirteen feature all of the research that Steve and I didn'tadvance the customized interviews that we put together for them, while keepinga solid core that was around the sheer beliefs of human centricity, customerCentricity, helping rather than selling leading with service and value seekingto generate recurring impact and knowing that recurring revenue is aconsequence of that. Just a lot of these common themes are all shared byby the folks that we're going to mention so the first one up was episode.One hundred and forty eight, with Dan Tyre Dan Tire is the sixth employee andfirst sales person at hub spot highly energetic, unique personality. Amazingexpert also an entrepreneur, started several companies before joining hubspot Steve, whether it's related to our interview for the book or the interviewfor the podcast were a couple thoughts or things that you're excited aboutregarding Dan Dan tire. Just the first thought that comes to mind in general,when I think of Dan Tire is good people win he's obviously succeeded in life.You know he probably doesn't have to work anymore. Let's, let's be honest,be the sixth member of of Hums. He succeeded my standards for retirement,yeah, yeah and so he's just a good person and he's winning and he likes toshare that knowledge and information. You the biggest lesson from from him,and maybe I'll, stick to the book, I'm going to stick to all of our the bookcontent and do interviews that that we did and the biggest lesson in hischapter, I think is people connect with you and not your products and that'swhat he's so good at he does break it down and give you some tactical advice.You know as well, but really what we learned from his chapter is how a salesperson specifically so, if you're a salesperson, this is definitely achapter. You know for you and how you can connect emotionally, which Dan Hillcontinued that conversation. You know with with your prospects and just andyou know, helping not selling, which was a common theme throughout the book.Absolutely fun thing about that. One too, is: He name dropped a few of hishub spot team members. I had already connected with one of them before, butI reached out to all three and got some additional insights and interviews andperspectives with them, which is something I don't think we did in anyother chapter. Next up is Lauren Bailey, founder and president of both factoryand Girls Club Bomboma's, a huge fan and participant in Girls Club, which ischanging the face of sales leadership by empowering women to achieve seats ofleadership inside sales organization, Steve Warder, a couple thoughts youhave about Lauren Bailey transformation is a single word that comes to mind.She talks about that through throughout. She talks about belief and belief inherself and shares stories how she was...

...bullied to turn on the camera and thenpick that up and ran with it and, as you mentioned with Girls Club, you knowher. Her main goal is to show people who and what they can be and help themachieve themselves. So again, going back to helping she is a helper. Shewants to see people thrive and she talks about those stories in herchapter and and how you can believe in yourself and how you can do better.Even if you don't in the beginning, love it. She also hammers some of thethe significant fundamental flaws in the way a lot of organizations aregoing to market right now. So I just I'll leave it at that. Third MattSweezy or Matthew Sweezy, director of market strategy at sales force, andwhile we were engaged with him, he also took on the role of partner at thesales force, futures lab, really interesting guy. I know we both lovedhis book, the Context Marketing Revolution, which we talked about in. Ithink it was episode sixty on this podcast, but that's off the top of myhead. I might be off on that number share a couple of thoughts aboutMatthew, yeah. Obviously, as you mentioned love's book, and it all comesdown to motivation, motivation on why you're doing the things that thatyou're doing and how you think about the prospect. You know he had a line inthere and I'm going no, I'm going to butcher this. But it is something likeif profit is your is your motive, then you're going to develop a mechanicalprocess, and obviously the book is all about human centered connection and howto do it in a more human centered way, with better results and that's the key.It's not just doing it in a different way and achieving the same results orworse results. We can do business and his chapter dives deep into doingbusiness a better way. That's more human! That's going to be morefulfilling and achieve you, those results and- and of course he talksabout that. A lot in his book to with the with the five part framework yeah,which we summarie. He was kind enough to allow us to summarize in this one,and it really is a nice content teas to his book, which Steve and I would bothrecommend to anyone that listens to this podcast and enjoys it. Youdefinitely want to pick up the context. Marketing Revolution next Morgan, J,Ingram I'll get so so morgan is a very dynamic person. He is also a videoprospecting pioneer, so there's a lot in there about video prospecting, he'sa not only a sales person, sales trainer, but also execute sales. Ithink his titles, director of sales execution and evolution at J B saleswith John Barrows, so he is preaching what he's practicing as well, whichallows him to stay sharp and the reason he reminds me of you, Steve, likesomething you both share- is that I look at you both and I just think hownaturally and seamlessly personal and Professional Development and growth isjust part of how you do things to share a word about Morgan, yeah, authentic. Ithink it would would be the word and brave and and all the people that arein the book are brave. You know you look at these people and they'veachieved what they achieve an you. Just think that they've always been that way,but there is always a story of struggle for them to get there and and Morgantalked a lot about it in the book of like hey he's, not he wasn't the bestBedr, but he was going to put it out there. He was going to talk about it onlink in he was going to create video content knowing and inviting people togo along in his journey, and he wasn't claiming to know it all or be the best,and so it's a really interesting intro to his chapter. Just just talking aboutthat. But then- and this is what I love about the book- It also gets tactical.You know if here is yeah, if you want to learn a framework for being morecommitted, because you know this is what you mentioned like he makescommitments and he sticks to it, and then he has frameworks for executing.You know on not not just on his commitments but actually is day to daywork. So if you are a Bedr, if you lead a team of drs or if you lead a team ofsales, raps mortgage chapter is going...

...to be really actionable for you,awesome Dan Hill, emotional intelligence, expert, author ofmultiple books I enjoy listening to his podcast called Dan Hills. Q spotlightand he also holds seven US patents in the analysis of facial coding data.Here he ties together, emotions memory and motivation. What are a couplethoughts about Dan Hill, I'm afraid Dan Hill, I'm afraid because remember when wewere interviewing him he's like I can read people's faces and let you knowthe type of person that you are he's like and I'm not going to do that.Don't worry, I'm not going to do it because I would lose friends if I did.But now, every time like, I have an interview with Dan Hell because he goesthrough all of the emotion, and you mentioned emotion, memory and andmotivation. Here's the funny thing Dan Hill is not a salesperson, but for the sales person or the sale leaderreading this book. His chapter is definitely one of the top threechapters to read and he has nothing to do with sales, because it's all about amotion which emotion drives action and if you want to get people to drive toaction and do the things you want them to do. This is a this chapter isamazing. It really is, and we put it really close to the front because itjust it s so foundational to so many of the rest of the teachings: MariaMartinez, junior, founder, modern sales, evangelist and CEO at Ven Gress. Whatcomes to mind we think about Mario's. This chapter one went a different routethan than what I twere. I thought it was going to go for sure, and we talkeda lot about you, hiring and hiring the right people and culture and being avideo first company, not for selling folks, but for the company itself,because he's dispersed to all and he's disperse all over the world and he'sbeen doing this for years and years and years. So we dug deep into using videoto build relationships between the people and the company how he hires theprocess that he uses when he hires folks, which is through video, makingsure that people have those skill sets. So this this chapter was fascinating ifyou lead a company or, if you're, a manager within the company you'restarting to work more remote. This. This is the chapter that you want toread yeah and to go back to the ex CX connection that we were talking aboutnear the top of the show here. Matthew, sweezy's chapter and Mario Martina'sjuniors chapter both have a lot of employee experience, employeeengagement, kind of implications to it, Julie, Hanson, professional actor,professional salesperson, turn professional sales manager, who nowteaches people to use classic acting techniques and Impropeh Nique to bemore effective sales professionals. What comes to mine, with Julie, yeahand you're, going to know the answer to this one, but because we talked aboutit when we decided we went, we wanted Julie to participate in the book andEth, and I didn't necessarily believe that acting had, you know, had a rolein vide video communication and we had conversations about it and you know, aswe began consuming Julie's content were like wait, a second see, then she mighthave something here, and so that's the most fascinating and there's a bunch ofthings that they're going to learn from Julie's chapter. But the mostfascinating element is how you can bring your authentic self to a rolethat you are playing, because at the end of the day, it still is you and theactions that you can do to be your best self through video and have that shinethrough because video mutes some things and we talk about the strategies tokind of turn it up a notch which we also did with Viveka, which we did withvivaces. Well, she calls herself Super Viv when she wants to raise it up forfor video content. Yeah really good, so this next gentleman, not only has hebeen on the podcast twice now. Not only is he a customer service and customerexperience expert who's been at it for decades. Not only is he a New YorkTimes in Wall Street Journal, best selling author of multiple books likenine books, or something like that he's...

...just a super nice dude and last thingin the book. We mentioned that to Pete like for folks who listen to the show.You know that I'm going to ask Steve here shortly to think or mentionsomeone who's had a positive impact on his life or career. This person, whosename I am about to mention, had been mentioned twice when we were writingthe book, but in that time he was actually mentioned the third time andGosh. If you, if you think about a legacy for your professional work, theidea that someone would mention you with the opportunity to just mentionanyone- that's had a part of positive impact on their life or career. Like myGosh, what a wonderful legacy this do to Shep hikin amazing person, Great Guy,really smart at what he does. What comes to mind when I say SHEP Hikin toyou Steve Those shepherds, amazing, it didn't go the way that I thought it wasgoing to go either, which was a nice pleasant surprise, because this one wasvery tactical, and I didn't think this was going to be tactical. You know atall one of my favorite parts of the chapter is him talking about hismethodology when he closes down or not closes down, but has conversations withhis his customers, and he goes through this for part framework of danger,opportunities, strength and future, and he breaks that down and like he showsyou how and he uses it for his own sales process. But anyone reading thebook is going to be able to use that same framework for their own salesprocess as well, which will help people connect again on a more human level andit's a human centered way to generate more business, so very tactical, whichwas a surprise yeah, so smart, because the questions that he offers in thatchapter and that he uses himself really draw out interesting and helpfulinformation. He said. Sometimes the questions are so provocative. Thecustomer needs to think about it and get back to him. So just even the thequestion process itself is of value to o the other person, and he takeseverything he learns and gives them their own thoughts and feelings andideas back and at some basic level, he's simply making sure that heunderstands them correctly in order to proceed in a way, that's going to helpthem for folks who are looking to do better virtual presentations and bettersales presentations, loads of practical stuff in chips. Chapter two: Next UpJack O' van der Coy founder of winning by design a sales engineer, a salesarchitect- and you know we talk a lot in the book about art versus scienceand how to balance those two, because we need a balance of the two. He seemsto be a very scientific sales expert. At the same time, he is one of the mostthoughtful warm and sincere people. I've interacted with in this type ofsetting so Steve. When I say Jack, O Vandercook comes to mind, I'm a fan fanof Jakos, the first thing that comes to mind, though, as is troller fishing inso good, definitely a big big part of the book which gets into counter impact,and you know he talks about thaller fishing and the impact that that has onthe environment, and he equates that to today's modern sales or maybe not somodern sales processes and how we're doing damage to to our ecosystem of ourtotal dressable market or I CP, and it's such a thought provoking chapter.I love that it's it's early in the book because it just sets up it sets upeverything for the rest of the book. Yeah for folks, listening, Jacko isfeatured in chapter three, which is right on the heels of the openingchapter, which is about digital pollution. Second Chapter is HumanCenter Communication, which in many ways is an antidote to all of thedigital pollution that pervades our virtual online and digital spaces thatwe all operate in every single day and that the fact that he tiedenvironmental pollution to digital pollution was just it just...

...was just another reminder that weinvited the right people into this conversation because it was completelyunprompted. So Viveka rose already mentioned: Viveka she's a CO founderwith Mario at Van Grasso. She is a master trainer she's, a teacher, a lotlike Shep Hikin. That's why their chapters kind of are adjacent to oneanother and any thoughts you have on vivace yeah the thing that stands out the most orseven lessons to better videos. That's what I remember most from ourconversation and the chapter itself, just the steps that she that she givesto people to take. It's very actionable. People can walk away and and rememberthe seven lessons and create better videos, easily awesome. The one thingthat popped out to me right away as I was going back through it after we, youknow so we'd prep, these interviews, we'd watch their youtube videos, welisten to their podcast, we've read their books, read their blogs and thenenter these interviews with them, and some of them were as long as two hours.Some were even over two hours, and so then we, you know, go back and watchthe recording, along with reading the transcript kind of in parallel, and thething that just jumped off the transcript to me was her story of theseventy percent, so many person on rate to hold out reach with video becauseone of the classes she teaches is that they're selling on video class at VenGrasso, and so you know we really pressed in a little bit to okay. Whatwas this person's sending? How did that go? What was she like before? was youjust amazing and video, so we get into that that process of generating thatamazing response rate from C sweet executives from an insurance salesperson. Last one here, Adam Contos, we've both known him for a long time.He is the CEO of Remak, the most recognized brand and real estate SteveThoughts on Adam I'm going to sound like a broken record, because this wasanother chapter that did not go the way that I thought it was going to goinitially and love the way that it turned out. You know, Adam Adam is he's a grinder he's a CEO, and youthink that, like oh he's going to be in this yea this high castle and and notdoing the the day to day dirty work and that's the exact opposite like he getsin it, and he talks about building relationships and report with his teamand how he does it. You know through video how he builds his own brand ifyou are interested in branding. This is the chapter for you because he goes indepth on how he makes connections with the people in metal matter, the most ofhis business, which are his agents, and he does it so darned well and heexplores on his own and he doesn't wait for people to do things for him and hejust tackles it head on and he talks about his thoughts around that in his mentality.You know around just going yeah really good and the importance of getting yourown voice out there and being available to people, so he talks about hisprocess for podcasting. He talks about the process for recording videos whichI think he said was like in a glorified closet in his base Ben and he said itup himself. You know it's just awesome. I agree with you, it's like I didn't. Iknew he did all that stuff. I just wasn't quite sure what the process wasand it was fun to be invited to it before we wind down a couple thoughtson like you and I both read a lot of books. What are a couple things thatyou really enjoy about? A good book experience like when an author or apublisher does something well. What are some things that you enjoy about a bookprocess and perhaps did any of those influence the way we went about thisyeah for sure I'm not a big fiction. I was going to backwards a big fictionfan then, so you know I don't like it when books are all high level with noactionable items, no takeaways or no interactive moments like that. Youdon't have to have interactive moments in your book as long as there o thereare steps that you can take to actually...

...execute on the things that that you'relearning and you know- actually, I have some books here that are that are greatexamples of that, like the road, less stupid, with written by Keith,Cunningham or visual collaboration like both of these books, they talk about iton a high level, and then they give you a step by step approach for improvingyour business or improving the way that you communicate and that's how I wantedto do human center communication, and we talked about that as well. You knowwe want to talk about the high level and what it means to be human centered.But what are the actual steps that you need to take because we didn't wantpeople to read through the entire book and be like that's Nice? I should dothat without having the path without having a road map without having thenext steps to take and knowing what results they're going to achieve, andso that was a big focus and it was hard to do, and I applaud you- you know, foryou know taking again all you know all of these different thoughts from elevendifferent people and putting it together into a coherent sequens thatpeople could action upon yeah I mean it was thank you for that. It was as agift from all of the people. I mean we had to develop the theoreticalframework to wrap around it, and I, and because you know it rather thanlikewise, on the far other end, it's just a collection of tactics withoutcontext or meaning or purpose or like. Why does any of this even matter, so wehad to tee up that whole theoretical framework which we do in the beginning.We go through all of these people, their perspectives, their teachingstheir lessons and then at the end, we do a few things. We round up all thestrategies and philosophies, and we have these people in their chapters andtheir ideas talk to each other, there's primarily agreement, although I won'tspoil anything for anyone that wants to look at it and get into it. But, forexample, not everyone agreed on how to use virtual backgrounds or whetherthese virtual backgrounds on zoom calls and and and those types of things, sothere's a little bit of disagreeing tent. There are a lot of commonalities,a lot of themes. We unpack those and then specifically top tips and tactics.We break down in Chapter Fifteen and then obviously look to the future withChapter Sixteen, which is intermittently exciting and scary, atthe same time, something fun that we did. We we wantedto bring this to life. I think you inspired this direction in thisdecision, but for folks who preorder the book and, if you're, listening toit late- and this is interesting to you still visit book at Bombombay- take alook at it. You know we can find some ways to continue bringing this book tolife for people, but while we're still in this preorder window here in earlyOctober, you know we created events and opportunities to interact directly withthese people who, by the way, thank you again to all of them and I'll name thembefore we wrap up, but not only did they give us hours of their time inadvance of and during the initial interview hours of their time,reviewing the material and giving us feedback and sometimes doing subsequent,like follow up interview as exchanges to really dial in things. For example,you mentioned Laura Bailey and getting bully to turn her camera on early inher career. You know we went back and asked her like hey. I know you, youmentioned that you kind of bully people to get their cameras on and she usesthat word playfully by the way. What are some of the things that you say sowe included a list of like five or six things you could say in order toencourage someone to turn their camera on. So not only did they do all thattime. They also spent time guessing with us on this podcast, but they're,also giving us time to guest on live interactive round tables where peoplewho have pre ordered the book at to ask these professionals questions directlyand interact and engagements like creative brainstorming with the peopleon the call we're doing a book club series where we'll read it, and many ofthese people in the week that we're talking about their chapter are goingto be live with us talk a little bit about how important it is to wrap thiswith more than just and by the way we...

...do have worksheets and chaptersummaries that you could have to, but I think that's where so many like bonusthings stop is like here's, some additional worksheets and summariesyeah I'll, give you a short and sweet answer to this one. I don't know howyou write a book called Human Centered Communication and you don't do yourbest to create a human centered experience or an interactive experiencearound the book. So we didn't sit there and think about well, it's not a Webenar it's going to be a round table, so people can actually ask questions tothe people in the book and not just make it a one way: Communication Stream!So like little things like that and how we approached you know all the packagesand and the offerings that we have around the book awesome. So those areall at Bombumba. The full address is Bombombay Dash, centered offer foroffers, but you a bomb where you go to bomb Acomas podcast,which is what I want to do this normally, where I share other episodesthat folks might enjoy. Obviously episode. Six with you Steve, where wetalk about exploring a shared belief, is the foundation for getting inrelationship with a supplier from the buyer side or with a with a buyer fromthe from the salesperson company supplier side of the relationship. Buthere I'm just going to point you back to episode forty eight with Dan Tyrethat one was called video messaging and the next normal that episode episode. Ohundred and forty eight kicked off this series that Steve Co hosted with me. Wedid complementary rather than redundant interviews to our first interview. Welearned a whole lot more and got to know all these people a lot better.They are all smart kind, generous accomplished people again on fortyeight with Dan Tire, and you can also listen to Lauren Bailey, Matthew,sweezy, Morgan, J, Ingram, Dan Hill, Ph d, which we didn't mention last time:Mario Martinez, Julier, Julie, Hanson, Shep, Hiken, Jack, O van der Coy Viva,Kavan, Rosen and Adam contos, and those are all up at bomboost or an applepodcast spotify. Wherever you prefer to listen Steve Before I let you go. Wouldyou please think or mention someone who's had a positive impact on yourlife or your career and give a nod or a shout out to a company or brand thatyou personally appreciate for the experience they deliver for you as acustomer I'll start off with the company or brand first and I'll go withancestral supplements as a company. They provide an amazing experience.Brian there, their founder will personally email. You ask you about.You know it's a supplement company. It's not really supplements its food,it's they're organs, their cattle organs, not not not human origensgrasped, New Zealand, cattle organ yeah grasp bad news, New Zealand organs andyou know like I was going to get into health stuff.I'm not going to do that. So I know we're out of time, but they haveawesome products with amazing reviews online and the reason why is becauseBrian reaches out and ask you about any ailments or what are you trying tosolve and he cares because then, like a month later, you'll get more emailsfrom him and they're, not pre written the emails they're. The email I gotfrom Brian was like hey: it's been a month since you've been on thesupplements. How how are you and your wife Gretchen doing it's like? Oh, myGod, like he's reaching out. Personally, it's just an amazing experience. Therewas another product that he had which hadn't tried yet, and he just sent itto me for free because he thought it would help like that's that stuff justdoesn't happen anymore, so ancestral supplements, if you're, if you have anyyou ailments, you're looking to get good nutrition people been eatingorgans for millions of years. Depending on how long you believe that humans abeen on this earth, except for the last like eighty years and so takingsomething out, that's been a part of our diet forever, as probably no Bueno,and this is a easy and less disgusting way to bring them back in...

...well said, yeah and and what I meanthis is something that couldn't quite be done this way years ago I mean he'sdoing business internationally, but he's doing business personally, buthe's doing business at scale, and so he's obviously got beautifully set upsystems. Clean data well organized good reminders. I'm sure he has some systemremind him that it's time to reach out to Steve, to ask Steve About this mentor situation and his wife Gretchen,and what she was trying to achieve and you know serves up what products wereordered and- and you know it doesn't it's not genius, but to execute itreally. Well is truly exceptional good call. How about a person yeah a person? Is You even you? The past was have been six years now soseven N, seven in January, yeah, seven in January. It's crazy and we've knowna jeer decade, it's it's going by so fast, but working with you learningfrom you O, seeing your approach to everything thatyou do in life has made me better. So thank you. That's really kind. Likewise,it's been a shared journey of growth exploration. I love that were able todo something like well the coasting the podcast, but then also the book itselfand it's it's a joy to be able to do it, and I appreciate you to that's reallykind. If people enjoy this conversation, of course, they can go to Bomba Daco apodcast. They can go back to episode. Six, they can go check out bombace.They can go to bomboost, learn more about the video messaging platform thatyou described in the beginning. But if you want to connect with you, whatLincoln is that the best place yeah Steve Personally on Twitter Linkedin?I'm Steven, though thought that through and that's ste phen pass on Lipa C. I ne Li awesome o course we'll link all that up at Bamboos podcast, where we dovideo highlights short write ups and we have the the audio player embeddedthere. You can search it by tax. You just type words and it'll jump to thatpoint. So Steve mentioned something here and you're like I don't want to go,listen to the whole episode again. I just want to hear him talk about that.One thing: Again: You can go to bomboost podcast in that player justtype in a couple words that come to mind, and it will jump you straight tothat point. It's really awesome so Steve. Thank you so much, it's been apleasure and I hope folks enjoy it, and if you were listening to this hit upSteve Stephen Pasinelli on linked in you can also hit me up there eth andbut would love to answer any questions you have about human centercommunication and how might it might be a benefit to you, your team, yourcompany, et Cetera, I think so much for listening and thank you Steve forspending this time with me. Yeah thanks for having me on and I'll see you inour meeting in twenty minutes sounds great. The digital spaces and channelswe rely on every single day are noisier and more polluted than ever. So how canyou break through gain attention, build trust, create engagement and improveour relationships, reputation and revenue? The authors of the BestSelling Book Rehumanize Your Business, take that question on in their new bookhuman centered communication, a business case against digital pollutionto help they brought in nearly a dozen experts in sales, marketing customerexperience, emotional intelligence leadership and beyond learn more abouthuman centered communication and see special preorder bonus packages byvisiting Bom Bombo Book, Improve Your revenue and reputation immediately andin the long term, visit Bom Bombo Book. Thanks for listening to the customerexperience. Podcast remember, the single most important thing you can dotoday is to create and deliver a better experience for your customers, continuelearning the latest strategies and...

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