The Customer Experience Podcast
The Customer Experience Podcast

Episode · 6 months ago

188. Aligning Sales, Marketing, and Customer Success Under a CRO w/ Sterling Snow


If customer experience is important to your company, you won’t achieve it without alignment between sales & marketing. Any interaction your customers have with your business can make or break that relationship.  

In this episode, I interview Sterling Snow , Chief Revenue Officer at Divvy | Inc. , about customer experience, how he’s been able to achieve alignment with his company, and tips for the listeners looking to do the same.  

Sterling talked with me about:

- The rise of customer experience and who’s responsible for it

- Divvy’s ideal customer & the problems it solves

- Segmenting resources to customers of differing size & advice to listeners

- The feedback loop: bringing sales & marketing together

- The internal communication needed to create alignment

- Pros & cons the listeners should be aware of around company alignment 

Check out these resources we mentioned during the podcast:

- Sterling Snow on LinkedIn 

- Sterling Snow on Twitter 

- Divvy 

- Woody Klemetson on LinkedIn 

- Calendly 

Subscribe, listen, and rate/review the Customer Experience Podcast on Apple Podcasts , Spotify , Google Play or Google Podcasts , and find more episodes on our blog.

As long as your economics support it. Don't ever make a change that makes the experience worse than the name of efficiency, but a lot of times they go hand in hand. The single most important thing you can do today is to create and deliver a better experience for your customers. Learn how sales, marketing and customer success experts create internal alignment, achieved desired outcomes and exceed customer expectations in a personal and human way. This is the customer experience podcast. Here's your host, Ethan Butte, on Linkedin and here on this podcast. We've talked about WHO's best to take on the role of chief revenue officer. Is it a sales leader, a marketing leader, a customer success leader or the probably the most common answer? It depends. This will theme will probably come up again as we talk through this trend toward aligning our revenue teams and structures and rolling it up to a chief revenue officer. Our guest is, you guessed it, a cro he oversees sales, marketing, customer success and customer support for Divy, a secure financial platform for businesses to manage payments and subscriptions, build strategic budgets and eliminate expense reports. Other titles he's held, by the way, include senior VP of revenue, vice president of Marketing Marketing, a sales director and even director of sales and marketing. Sterling snow, welcome to the customer experience podcast. Hey, thanks for having me. Yeah, really excited for the conversation. I Love Your Energy, I love your and we're talking before we hit records and we're just talking about the weekend coming up because we're recording this on a Friday, and you just kind of expressed your passion for these themes. So I'm I'm really excited, given your background and given your sincere passion for these themes in our even our pre call, to get into it and I want to start where we always start, which is customer experience. When I say customer experience, what does that mean to you, stirling? Yeah, that that to me is an all encompassing term for the interactions that that a customer has with your business, like the entire thing. So that means what do they get when they touch the product? Where do they get when they talk to sales, when they see a piece of marketing collateralds, anytime that the customer is touching an interaction with with your company. That's customer experience. Cool. Absolutely agree. For you as a crow over all, four of those functions I mentioned in the intro. Do you have a title or a even a small team dedicated to C X, or is it more of a culture or an ethos that everyone is mutually responsible for? Yeah, so we definitely have. We have folks who are or over the the success experience right, especially like the traditional titles. That's a post sale motion and you get into customer success, customer support, those types of things, but it's very much something that we preach from top to bottom, from a whole revenue perspective or from a whole company perspective as well. Cool. We're going to probably peel this apart and get deeper into it, but here while we're still kind of on the CX theme. You know, I've identified and asked a question like this to a variety of people and it...

...seems to be consistent that a lot of people are seeing it the way that I am, which is that the rise in the conversation around customer experience, the rise or in the how frequently we're seeing someone moved to a crow position and rolling these things up under one leader. Obviously, the rise of revops to tie all the systems that used to be disparate together. From your view, a are all those things connected and be what do you think are a couple key factors driving that as a trend? Yeah, so I do think that all those things are very connected. They're all sort of getting at the the same root issue and the same thing that people are trying to optimize for, which is funnel alignment, funnel efficiency, you know, eliminating things that have traditionally caused friction in the funnel, like data problem stuff like that. So you see a rebops that's designed to support and be the train tracks that everybody runs on, keeps everything on time and you worry less about arguing about whose data is ride and you know, stuff like that. But that's that's addressing the same thing that the rise of a chief revenue officer and that role becoming more encompassing than it has in the past, where people are owning more of the funnel, more of the end end experience because, like we talked about at the beginning, anytime somebody touches any part of that, that's the customer experience and you're responsible for it. And if you have multiple disparate people sort of building in silos, that customer experience starts to have a lot of weirdness in it. That isn't a benefit to the customer. So Yep, I think those are all very much tied very much on their eyes. I think that's the way the best companies are looking at providing a better experience. Awesome. Before we go farther, for context for listeners, tell us in your I gave a one liner of about divvy, but you know in your own words, who is divvy? Who's your ideal customer? What problems are you solving for them? Yeah, so divvy is a corporate credit card that is fused with financial software, so it automates things like expense reports and budgeting and sending and requesting funds, different things like that, and it's a free tool because we make money like a bank. To us, it's completely free to our customers and we serve people honestly, from one or two employees all the way up to thousands, and we have very specific segments and experience. This sort of parsed out because if you're a fifty person operation, it's a little bit different than if you're a public company. But that's that's who we are and who we serve. We're very proud of the fact that we build for Middle America and we build for everyone and we believe that that technology companies in a lot of ways have built really good software for other technology companies then not as much for the everyday business that really is the backbone of of our national economy. So that's what we are and what we do and we we...

...appreciate that value layer that you added there, or the perspective or point of view. Go one layer deeper, because this is something we don't talk about often enough, but it certainly something we talk about a lot inside bomb on because, like you, one person can come in and buy an account and we have people that have been with us for eight, nine, ten years, paying us, you know, the the rate that they signed up for back then. We kind of honor legacy pricing in those cases. And and of course we have accounts with thousands of seats with us and everything in between. And frankly, you know from from the equivalent of your seat here. When we think about the marketing and sales and customer success, the way we're going to design the way we're going to structure, the way we're going to, you know, try to determine. Okay, we can't serve all of these people equally well. You know, how do we preference? How do we prioritize that? The only reason I'm leaning in here is that, Ay, it's a problem we haven't talked about much. Be It's a problem of probably a lot of people are facing at some level, even if it's just two tracks or three tracks instead of you know, you might be slicing into five. That's kind of where I'm going to the question. And then and then the other one is, you know, you can't serve everyone equally well. You do have to make some choices. Any your this is just my own philosophy. I just so you can start with your take on this. You know, any organization that is running in a healthy manner does have some resource restraints, right, like even someone that's funded with hundreds of millions of dollars needs to be doing that in a very thoughtful and kind of tight way. So how do you, as cro think about that broad range of customers? How many tracks if you designed and you have do you have a marketing team and a sales team? And a CS team or like little pods that are dedicated to that type of customer. How do you approach that? Because it's a complex issue. Yeah, it is, and I can tell you spent spend a lot of time thinking and talking about this. So, because you got it right, like we have five different segments. Right, so we start with our smallest, which is selfserve, and then all the way up to our biggest, which we call corporate. And the way that, the way that, because you're right, you can't. You can't have a sales rep for the very smallest and a CSM for the very smallest. Like your unit economics will not support that sort of emotion. So what you have to do is look at look at your customer base and then start to segment where it makes sense. So when we call something self serve, it means a certain thing. It's based on annual revenue or employee size or whatever works for your business and they don't really touch anybody other than other than the marketing stuff. So there's a marketing funnel for selfserve and there's a target for selfserve and there's funds dedicated to going out and getting those selfserve customers but then they don't really get anything else right. There's no there's no manual sales touch, there's not a dedicated customer success manager. But then they do get support right. And we want, because of the customer experience and the brand angle of this, we want to be very generous with support. So anybody gets phone, chat, email, seven like that. That's that's how we built our...

...model and we could be more efficient and say, you know, you actually only get chat, for example. That would save US some efficiencies, but not not enough in my my opinion, to outweigh what what it costs when people feel like they're not being listened to and responded too fast. But that's a very different motion than your up market stuff where you come in through a demand channel. The same thing, but you talk to a sales rep, you go through a sales process, then you are assigned an implementation specialist for your first three months, then you are assigned a dedicated customer success manager and there they're more your proactive point of contact and you have all the the support resources that the selfserve folks do. So it's really about looking at your segments, looking at the unit economics for each of those segments. And then deciding how much resource you can decide to dedicate. They're awesome, really thoughtful. For you. How the structured around that? You have like leaders of these segments, like essentially like business owners of these segments, and then, you know, potted out or something like that underneath that? Or do you have like a marketing leader, sales leader, customer success leader, and they manage all five tracks per yeah, so we do have. We do have like a VP of marketing, VP of sales, all of those types of things. But then within their teams they are they are built to match to our segments. So there is a corporate customer success team that Rolls Up to the the VP of customer success. Right, everything matches. So so it always flows through the same portion. You get sorted out when you come in through the marketing channels and then you flow through your track. So the same managers and reps that normally working with each other. They are the ones managing those different handoff points. But yeah, you always have to build it to match or you're just going to have a very disjointed experience. Yeah, one more here, I think the match. Are you looking at your data and seeing, like where should we draw the lines, like Ay, I guess it to back up a little bit before we get specifically and into you and your role, which I have a number of things I'm really curious about. But how long it has it been a five track? Like was it three to start? Did it get to five, like and and and what I'm doing here is for the benefit of a listener who's like, we've got a big messy group of customers. We like them all for different reasons. We might choose to preference, you know, our marketing and sales spend toward one over the other, but we'll serve whatever comes in the door. Or we have two tracks now we feel like it should be for like. I assume that this was kind of a data driven decision to figure out where to draw the lines and how to organize it. But talk about that matching, like matching the customer diversity to the tracks. Yeah, so really good points, because when you start out it's just a giant Hodge podge, okay, and you're just you're just trying to get customers right. You know, we've been we've been at this for five years and raised half a billion dollars in on like.

So we definitely are not where where we were when we started out. So take it back to that level. You do just have sort of this hodge pods and you don't really understand it. And then you have to go in and start parsing them out and you'll start to see some natural lines and you're looking at a couple different things, like do our close rates improve if a customer of this size touches a sales rep or not? So that's a test that we ran right and then we found out that up to a certain number of employees it didn't matter. It wasn't helping the customer experience at Allso Bam, there's our line. There's our self serve segment, and that's a pretty easy example. And then the rest you're doing very similar types of tests and types of looking and that's how you start to determine your lines. And the other thing I'll say is you're always, always tweaking this. Every every time we release a new COMPLAN, which we try to do once a year, we're tweaking segments and making things different. So, for example, the segment that is one up from our self serve segment, which we call SMB. They were prior to this most recent change getting sold and then getting past to an implementation specialist. Well, we ran a test and said if the sales rep was the implementation specialist and there was no Handif were we going to see any any difference at all? And we didn't. So we created a hybrid roll for that smaller customer. If we would, if we did that with corporate, it would be a very bad idea, but it was a good idea for the the segmentations that we have. So yeah, you're always looking at different data points trying to say is the experience better or worse for this and is there an efficiency to be gained from making a change here? And I would say as long as your economics support it, don't ever make a change that makes the experience worse in the name of efficiency. But a lot of times they go hand in hand because when a customer is having a good experience, they flow through it. It goes very fast. When they're not, that's where you get stuck or you have friction. So normally the two are very much, very much tied together. I so appreciate so many things you just shared, specifically the call out on efficiency. I think we have a bias toward it when in fact it could be to the detriment of the customer experience and therefore actually a detriment to the business net, you know, in the medium to long term. I also really appreciate that your time this exercise to the comp plan in some guy just just the idea along. So I was going to ask, although I felt like you'd made it clear earlier, but then you said, oh, it's actually more nuance than I thought. I was going to ask about kind of that. Are Any of these people responsible kind of you know, full cycle sales, for example, and now it sounds like in that next up from self serve, it is a that hybrid role, but you've accounted for it from a company. It's not like, Hey, guess what, your commission is exactly the same, but you now also have to implement all these people that are all tied together. And so this what you're doing inherently with motivating and compensating people, completely...

...aligned with what's best for the customer or this type of customers. Just really smart. Let's take it. Let's stake because you took it back a minute ago. Let's go back a little bit too, just prior to you being named Cro what was going on inside the company that had divvy aligned sales, marketing, customer success, customers support under you as initially senior VP of revenue. And why were you, as VP marketing, the right person for that? Yeah, so really good questions. To take you one step further back and to give context, at my company prior to Divus, a company called Jive, and we we did some really cool things there. I came in work for work for the founders, who were awesome. We grew that business. Sold that business for four hundred fifty million bucks, which at the time was awesome. Now it's like a decent sized seed round, but that was, you know, times of change a little bit. One of the problems we had, and I was on the marketing team over there, is that we would pass over all of our demand and it wasn't work in the way we wanted. So it's this constant, just absolute war between marketing and sales and whose data's ride and do our lead soccer? Do you just suck at closing? I'm like just everything that I think companies have dealt with historically. And so we actually raised our hands. We said, Hey, put sales inside of marketing right now and if you know we'll be able to figure you're out who sucks here. That was kind of the impetus. But we didn't. We ended up not figuring out who sucked. We ended up figuring out how to work together and how to how to make it a better thing. So the feedback loops from sales were closer and better to us and we were more receptive and we ended up fixing a pretty broken relationship there. And so when I came to divvy, I was all about it, and this was before chief for revenue officers were getting a ton of traction. This is five, six years ago. And I told Blake, our CEO, I said I will come in and I'll start working on the top of the funnel, but I need to I need to know that you're on board with uniting the whole thing and hopefully I can prove to you I'm that person. If I'm not, I still think we need to hire that person because I believe that's the right structure of the right strategy. So he was. He was aligned with that and that's how it went. Once, once I kind of got the top of the funnel really dialed, really humming, said okay, now I'm going to Nowmin own sales, now, my own success will just kind of build down the funnel, and that's that's what happened and luckily the people who were who were here and who were working on the stuff with me were talented enough to overcome my my idiocy and we were able to be successful. So it just kind of kept working and that's how it ended up like happening and being me awesome something you said. There's somewhere I wanted to go, so I guess we'll just go there right now. You talked about in your in your previous experience at Jive, when you brought sales and marketing together, the feedback loops from sales got tighter. I think we'll often have a conversation on a show like this about voice of the customer and it's very often based..., you know, things that were hearing in terms of NPS or customer satisfaction or those types of things. Maybe some social listening, some online reviews, etc. But I don't think there's been enough conversation about that feedback loop. It was obviously very impactful on you years ago that you would still mention it today, even in a quick pass on like a important period in your entire in your career. You know, I'm sure that you your talking about months, if not years, and I'm sure it was influential in your vision coming into divvy, which, by the way, is really interesting that you just cast this vision and I'm your guy in too, like maybe prove that I'm not, which congratulations on senior vision all the way through. It's awesome. Talk about that feedback loop from sales, their frontline. They're talking with prospects every single day. Some of them are customers, some of them are not. Why is this the case? Who are the ones that ask the better questions versus the worst questions? I know, like when we were vertically focused in one vertical and then we sided to experiment at a conference or a trade show years ago in another industry that was nearby, one of our sales guys came back and said they don't ask pricing questions, they ask questions about you know, they has better, higher level questions. Like we need to do more of this, like talk about some of the importance of that feedback loop from sales back into marketing in particular, and then maybe we can move on to from success into marketing. It's a super for important process right, because you're testing. So in a lot of ways I compare demangin to to turning off the lights in a room and fumbling around and trying to find a paper clip, like you really are bumping in, you're using your hands and you know, I'll six senses to try and find something. That's very elusive and what you need. What would be a lot more helpful is if you were getting very quick, real time feedback from sales. Okay, we just tried this new PPL sore, so we just tried this PPC campaign. Tell me how these things are coming in right, and I think that that that principle carries into support to product, like all of these touch points where you have a facetoface with a customer. You need to be harvesting all of that information and using it to make you smarter. So yeah, that was what we did back at Jive and we were testing a lot of different things, but we ended up really cracking the code on PPL's which, in our space, that was a very sustainable, very long term thing and in a close partnership with sales, we made that a very viable and efficient demandin channel for us. So sales life got better because they were very well fed and they were able to go out and do what they needed to do. Marketing was doing a good jobs for supporting sales. So yeah, it's incredibly important and very easy to say and very hard to do because you're just buzzing along and you don't usually take the time to it, to do that and there's often...

...times like a lack of respect or empathy to it's kind of like, Hey, I just want you to go out and hit your number. I don't really want to like talk to you or listen to any of your feedback. I'm the smart marketer. That's that happens sometimes. Not Not a divvy, but the great ones they sit so close together because the great marketers they want to hear all that and they want to know how to be tweaking and optimizing or abandoning something completely if it's just not not the right thing. So anyway, yeah, that that is a good, good learning for me. So interesting. You know, I think so often a marketer will look at a paper lead or a paper click or any other channel for that matter, look at how it's converting. If they're really clever, the look at how it's converting to revenue, not just converting to opportunity. But what you're offering here, and correct me if I'm wrong, is adding like a richer, more human, more qualitative layer by talking to the person that's interacting with this other person and saying, I see what the numbers look like, I see what the percentages look like, tell me more about what the experiences for you is to sales wrapping with their you know. Or is it also metric like talk about that blend of the quality, rich qualitative feedback blended with the metrics? Yep, it's definitely both, because you can see all of that stuff relatively, relatively easily. Right, if you're doing decent attribution, you're able to understand what's converting. Like you said, the better, the better you are, and, by the way, you should design your complans like this. But the better you are, the further down the funnel you're looking. Okay, but you also need to be like having that conversation and asking for ideas, because you know, if you have you have a sales team of twenty folks, there is an immense opportunity for you to hear what they're hearing, to feel what they're feeling and to get some of their ideas. So, going back to that jive story, what we started to do was once a week we took forty five minutes and we actually walk through the data together. So this is a meeting with like thirty five people, and then we would say, so, this is what we're seeing, but what are you hearing and what are you feeling? So, just like you said, it's very much like trying to blend the qualitative and quantitative sides of this, because it's both and marketing and sales. Anything go to market, in my opinion, should be equal parts art and science, and if you try and discount one or the other, you're probably leaving some growth on the table. So important I and we just think of a number of benefits just in that meeting that you described, which is of course we're going to understand even better which of these channels is actually working, because what looks like it working may not actually be working or not working the way we think. So you're kind of validating some of that. You're probably improving the messaging dramatically, which then we'll drive further improvements in engagement, whether it's a paid or or an organic or a whatever kind of distribution you're doing, but these opt to create opportunities and conversations. But then I also think it's bet the absolute most basic human level.

As a salesperson, I feel appreciated, I feel seen, I feel engaged, I feel like that I am truly a part of this, like it's just super powerful. I don't feel like this is common. How common do you think that that type of activity is? It feels like a secret sauce that everyone intuitively knows is a smart thing to do, but I feel like probably not very many people are doing it. Yeah, a hundred percent agree. Like part of the value you get is from people feeling like they're on the same team and that that gives some emotional recharging in a business where it's draining right. It's hard to go out and in land new deals, it's hard to launch a campaign that's successful. All of it's very difficult. It becomes less difficult if you feel like your partners are actually your partners. But it plenty of organizations people feel like they're fighting externally to grow the business and they feel like they're fighting internally to, you know, maintain reputation or get resources or whatever the case is. So yeah, I would agree with you that it's a relatively simple thing to do, but I don't know of a lot of companies to really do it. Now I will also say people who unify under a chief revenue structure. You kind of do this implicitly. You're all hands, you're talking about everything, you're talking about the entire funnel. You're not. You're not just talking about one thing or another. So it's just another example of how, when you unify, you just don't have the silos that it exist and the problems that go with them, a lot of which are emotional. Awesome. Let's walk out where you just were, which, because there's something else that's curious about talk about meeting cadences and internal communication to create that alignment. You just said that you have a an all hands, which I assumes a pretty big meeting, so you probably don't have it all that often, or maybe you do. Talk about just in general to create this alignment, to get everyone on the same page, to create the shared buying and even just getting people to know each other at some basic level and respect to work that each other's doing. What is the kind of internal communication and meeting cadence approximately? Yeah, so for the bigger ones, like all hands. We do that on a monthly basis and what we're doing is we are showing how we performed again at each stage the funnel versus our goals for the prior month. We run everything on a monthly on a monthly quota. Everyone in my organization has a quota from marketing to customer success, and we talked about how the teams did against those. And that's a monthly meeting. And the thing that that everybody knows about meetings is efficient. Good meetings are worth their weight in gold. But you end up with an organization that probably has eighty percent two meetings. I'm sure that I am no different, but you you keep you keep working on it, you keep trying, and so what we do is we have the revenue all hands, which is all the departments, and at this point that's, you know, four hundred, five hundred people, something like that, and then every department also has,...

...also hasn't all hands, that they do that's a little bit shorter, a little bit more specialized to them, any specific changes in their department, things that weren't appropriate like an all hands level. And then really the only other very formal things are like my leadership meeting, my forecasting meeting, but all of those sort of trickle down. Right if I have a forecasting meeting, it's because the sales managers had a forecasting meeting, and so those are the big those are kind of the big five that we have and and it's always, always a very interesting exercise to try and get the most out of them. You mentioned getting people to know each other and respect each other and and one thing that we've done there that I really like is at the beginning of these meetings we have what's called who am I, and a random person will kind of tell their life story and it's it actually ends up being like I've cried and many, a many a meeting, because people have very interesting and very touching lives and sometimes very, very heartbreaking challenges that they've come through that make them who they are, and it's very hard to not like and respect someone when you have that sort of an understanding about their life beyond just the work that you're doing. So yeah, that's that's one way that that's kind of our meeting cadence and maybe one way we've found to help people like and respect each other a little bit more. That is awesome. I love that tip. It's just like a super practical one for folks listening. That's why we have back buttons on these podcasts. That sounds like something that would be easy to implement ment and something that you could implement next week in a way that helps people understand one another. I absolutely appreciate that. To the top of the you know, to the intro that I put together. There, I'm sure you'll probably land where anyone would land. Is that in the IT depends. But in terms of leading these functions, do you have a bias or preference or any kind of like pros and cons, like or a default sales marketing customer success or? It depends. In terms of tying these things together, is it really just about the person or their skills inherent? Do you think it was perhaps your initial experimentation and blending marketing and sales together in a previous role? Like how would you think about someone that says I like these ideas, I've been here's another touch point is how I read books, by the way, that when I finally hear someone recommend it for the fourth time, like fine, I'll break down and read it, you know. So someone might be hearing this at the break point and saying like, okay, we really do need to get serious about aligning these functions, breaking down the silos. I, like with Sterling, had to say we're should someone start looking, or how should someone start thinking about? Perhaps the internal leaders currently about? And I know it depends as the thing, but any obvious pros and cons or things that you would caution or encourage people on? Yep, it is very dependent on, like the skill sets and the background of a person. What I would say you need is a high degree of like self awareness, because I would not sit here and tell you that I am...

...the leading customer success expert of divvy or that I am the rebops Guru a divvy. And I think that you have to know if you're going to if you're going to oversee the whole thing. You have to know what your unique strengths are and then be able to recruit phenomenal people to help build what. What you're not going to be good at right and you know this is this is a painful lesson for me because in a lot of ways there were things that I held on too too long or I believe that I did need to be the expert and so I hampered us in a lot of ways and there's there's hires and moves I should have made that I made a year, year and a half too late in a lot of situations and you know, won't make that mistake again, but I think it's very common. The other thing that I would say is you have to have a person who can garner the respect of each individual function and I think that that is a derivative of being able to be they have to think you know what it's like to be in their shoes. Okay, so if I am going to be respected by a CSM without ever having held that job, I have to be pretty empathetic. I have to show that I understand what the job is, what the challenges are like, and they have to believe that that's genuine and authentic and is going into how I am building out the entire revenue function, because the really easy thing to do, let's use me as an example, would be sales up. Uncle Sterling came up through marketing. He's never had he's never had to deal with what I've had to deal with and that could lead to a lack of respect in a really tough leadership position, because if people don't respect you, they're not going to follow you and you're going to fail as a leader. So you're right, it depends, but those are a few of the key tenants. I think the people who are ready for that role have really good I appreciate the empathy peace in particular as the foundation for respect. Really good stuff. You're obviously in the right seat. I so appreciate everything that you've shared for folks listening. If you have also enjoyed this conversation with sterling as I have, I've got two more than I know you like. One is episode one hundred and sixty five with Mark Rosenthal. He's COO at a software company called HQO, but he was previously cro and, prior to that, VP of marketing, sales and customers success there. We called that one three steps to building a collaborative culture and Sterling, we spend a lot of time in that conversation kind of where you and I were maybe three quarters the way through, around structure, hidences, communication. It's really interesting that that human element that you brought to some of the meetings that you all have brought there a divvy. He talked about that as an add to some of his all team emails that he would send out on a regular basis when he would share kind of this personal moment. That's what always got the most response and really galvanized people around it. That's one hundred and sixty five with Bark Rosenthal and then, slightly more recently, one hundred and sixty seven with brandy star, Roley Keenan and Mike Geller. They are the COOCRO and CTEO at Tegrida. We called that one essential Tra rates of the next generation crow.

They talked around a lot of those themes that we ended on, which is like, how should we be thinking about this? What characteristics should we be looking for? In addition, we got into some of the stuff that you really smartly offered off the top, which is why does this alignment and structure makes so much sense. So Sterling, before I let you go, relationships are our number one core value here at bombomb so I'd love for you to share a little bit about a relationship that's been meaningful. You eat to, you give a shout out or a thanks to someone who's had a positive impact on your life, for your career. Yeah, there's there are so many folks but this week in particular I'm thinking about the first guy, our first senior person I really recruited to come and help build divvy's names, woody Clementson. He runs all of sales for us and I don't this week in particular, been feeling a huge debt of gratitude for him being willing to be in the trenches with me for the past four years or so and he's done amazing is probably more responsible for some of my my learnings and hopefully becoming better than anyone else. So Woody Clementson's my big thank you today. Awesome well done, and it's customer experience podcast. You're a customer of many things yourselves. Is there a brand or a company that you'd like to give a shout out to for the experience they deliver for you? Yeah, so I'm going to I'm going to cheat. We because we serve other businesses. Love it. I get to know a lot of our customers and calendly is a divvy customer and I think they're phenomenal and I think what they've done to call undering and scheduling and some of those things is like remarkable and also from a business perspective, the product led growth that they've been able to see and Tope in that team. I think you're just phenomenal. So callndly is is it a company and a tool that I love to use and I love to try and figure out how to be more like them. Awesome. They are in rare air, at least relative to the show. There an amazing company, but rare are here. They are very few companies that get shouted out more than once side. This is at least the second calndly mention. Yeah, maybe a hundred eighty or a hundred eighty five episodes in, so they join. Stitch fix is one which is interesting because, like the human tech divide, there yea balance. I guess I should say it's not really divide, but anyway, appreciate that one. How can someone follow up with you, learn more about you, connect with you? Probably linked in. How can someone connect with divvy? Where would you send people who enjoyed this? Yeah, Linkedin and twitter are good for me. Sterling snow at Divvy, and then and then divvy. Just get divvycom and come come take a look at stuff and tell us what we can do better. Awesome. Thank you so much. Really enjoyed this great insights and I hope you have a great I already said we're recording on a Friday, so I'll just close it out that way. Have an awesome Friday afternoon in a wonderful weekend awesome things. You've been fun, fun conversation. We have art inbox constantly foam. We constantly have messages coming in. Work email just went up twe hundred and one. Have Ninety nine plus six hundred and seventy nine on ready email. We're here to talk...

...about a major problem. My name is Kitpbodner and I'm the chief marketing officer at help spot. I probably get ten to fifteen phone calls a day unwanted, and I probably get fifty a hundred emails a day unwanted. When I think about noise and trying to get that out of my life, I think about it through my most scarce resource, was just my time and attention. Is it worth my attention every here versus like me spending a moment with my son or cooking a meal with my son? The answers almost always know. We also know that the byproduct of that noise is feeling overwhelmed, feeling like there's not enough signal and that you feel discobobulated or confused. That's at least how I feel, so I also tried to protect myself from those feelings as well. Watch dear first name, a four part first of its kind documentary series now on Youtube, and explore how digital pollution is a roting our ability to communicate with each other and build trust. Clear Communication, human connection, higher conversion. These are just some of the benefits of adding video to the messages you're sending every day. It's easy to do with just a little guidance, so pick up the official book. Rehumanize Your Business. How personal videos accelerate sales and improve customer experience. Learn more in order today at Bombombcom Book. That's bomb bombcom book. Thank for listening to the customer experience podcast. Remember, the single most important thing you can do today is to create and deliver a better experience for your customers. Continue Learning the latest strategies and tactics by subscribing right now in your favorite podcast player, or visit bombombcom slash podcast.

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