The Customer Experience Podcast
The Customer Experience Podcast

Episode 118 · 11 months ago

118. The 3 C’s That Make or Break the SDR Experience w/ Ernest Owusu

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

Imagine you’re a new SDR, and your manager tells you to ‘Shut up and dial!’ The experience for the person on the other end of the line is going to be less than exceptional, don’t you think?

In order to land promising meetings, we’ve got to stop measuring success by volume.

In this episode, Ernest Owusu — retired NFL athlete turned Sales Development Leader at 6sense — talks to me about…

- Why volume shouldn’t define an SDR’s success

- 4 sales development tactics that aren’t going anywhere

- Best practices for hiring and onboarding SDRs

- The 3 C’s that SDRs need to offer exceptional CX

Follow Ernest on LinkedIn or Twitter @theernestowusu.

Subscribe, listen, and rate/review the Customer Experience Podcast on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Google Play or Google Podcasts, and find more episodes on our blog.

So it's no forms, no spam, no coal calls. We only go after companies that are actually interested inour products, and I think fundamentally a lot of us, as buyers andsellers, can appreciate that, because it only makes sense to have a conversationwith someone that actually would want to talk to you and ultimate buy your product. It just fundament and makes sense. The single most important thing you cando today is to create and deliver a better experience for your customers. Learnhow sales, marketing and customer success experts create internal alignment, achieved desired outcomesand exceed customer expectations in a personal and human way. This is the customerexperience podcast. Here's your host, Ethan Butte Hey. If you've been listeningto the customer experience podcast, you know that we open each episode with anIntro that I research right and read, but today's guest has an about sectionon Linkedin that really says it best, so I'll read that. Leveraging myexperience as an NFL athlete turn sales development leader, I do three things.One, teach sellers potent prospecting tactics that generate meetings to educate sales and marketingleaders on the specific areas of focus for leading sales development orgs, and threeadvise executives on what they must do to build and scale a world class salesdevelopment team. So we're obviously talking sales development in this episod. So theearly stages of the customer experience some of the earliest impressions and relationships that ourcustomers have with our team members. And our guest spent nearly four years atPersado as a sales development rep manager and director as well as an account executive. Today he serves as the senior director of sales development at six cents,and account engagement platform, perhaps best known for its ability to surface buyer intentfor your sales and marketing teams. And if you're still wondering about the NFLathlete part of his linkedin about section. He played for both the Minnesota Vikingsand the Tampa Bay buccaneers and played professionally in Canada and Australia, all asa defensive end. Ernest to Wusue. Welcome to the customer experience podcast.Yeah, thanks, as are having me appreciate it. Yeah, I'll spareyou and listeners from too many sports analogies but is there anything about football ingeneral, or the defensive end position in particular, that's been useful to youin your career in sales and sales development? Yeah, most definitely. I thinkwith with SDR bet our team, especially right now with how crazy theworld is, with Covid I've learned a lot around the important on a strongculture. It definitely wouldn't say that if I didn't have any experience at whatI will do that and that culture building asthet that brought to my team tohelp us whether almost any storm we've had, not only just at being a Poiwhere wor you know, surviving with more Smal thriving. So that's probablystrongest thing I learned from my football career. Cool culture is definitely going to comeup later in our conversation and just another quick observation I want to makeand see if you have anything to share on that. Obviously, that aboutsection. One of the reasons I liked it so much was that it,the structure of it is clear and simple and even more so I appreciate howit promotes alignment from the C suite to the front lines. You spoke tokind of three layers of the organization there. Obviously was intentional, but you wantto share anything else about that? Yeah, you're exactly right. Iwasn'tentional. And it's interesting too, because you know str team, you don't? You do have to have that cross departmental alignment between sales, marketing,you know, initial contrivers, as well as executives, because a lot ofpeople, you know, they didn't they there's a lot to learn about howto run effective Dr Sdr team and there's a lot that people just don't know. But it's really important for all three layers that have a strong understanding ofthat so the team could drive awesome. So I'm looking forward to getting intothat too. But we'll start where we always start, earnest. Will startwith customer experience. When I say that, does it mean anything in particular toyou? Yeah, most definitely, I will say, especially if someonewho I will say, you know, if you don't do a well onthe SDR, BDR front, a lot of people feel like you don't leavethe best customer experience. But if you...

...know, to me, customer experienceis more or less of the product of how you make your customers feel before, during and after they buy your product. So it's definitely something that that reignsvery suppertime for me and you know, SDR be, your teams have alot to do with the overall customer experience, whether or not you knowsome actually does buy your products. It's really important for us to take atthe speration. Awesome, well done, and and I agree it does.There's are so much that happens at that stage, you know, like we'vemaybe done some of our research and now we're finally engaging with another human being, representing this brand, representing the opportunity and, in a lot of ways, managing expectations, and so I'm right there with you. For people whoaren't familiar, tell us a little bit about six cents, like who isyour ideal customer and what do you solve for them? Yeah, sure,so six sense is basically an account based orchestration platform that helps sales and marketingidentify which companies want, essentially by the product. Once we're able to helpyou find that in priorities, priorities as accounts and ultimately engagement in a waythat's most meaningful for them and agains especially going off a customer experience. Webasically tell people, you know what they want to hear based upon what kindof digital footprint they're sending us. Yeah, go a little bit deeper into that, like so, so. So some of the words and phrases Iassociate it with it are, you know, intent and intent data being in market, right. So, so, for folks that are listening, andcorrect me where I'm wrong here. So, folks who are listening, you know, so many of us are putting together these these target lists based onkind of generalized criteria. But what six sens is doing is saying, well, you may have your lists, and that's cool and you might use them, but here's a list of people that are actually in market for your productbased on the way that they're behaving online. So maybe stitch that together a littlebit more. Yeah, most definitely, and we actually have a really interestingMontro here where we say no forms, no spam, no cold calls.So the reality is, like, my team is definitely calling people,but by no means is a cold because we only want to go after peoplethat are actually in market to buy our product. So there's a lot ofdifferent reasons as to why that might happen, whether the company is doing research ortheir poking on your website or doing all this kind of digital activity that'susually most closely aligned to some of your current customers. That's our sweet spot. We want to make sure that my team is only going after those firstand foremost because to make sure that there is a strong customer experience, itonly makes sense for talking to actually want to buy from us. It totallydoes. I mean there's so much activity than a noise us. I'm sureyou're on the receiving end of a lot of outreach where you like. Idon't represent that part of the organization. I would never be a decisionmaker inthat process. I'm not even an influencer over these this product category. Iget so much outreach that way, and so I would love for you tosee that mantra one more time because I think it would really make a lotof people who would listen to the show excited. Yeah, definitely. Soit's no forms, no spam, no cold calls. We only go aftercompanies that are actually interested in our products, and I think fundamentally a lot ofus, as buyers and sellers, can appreciate that, because it onlymakes sense to have a conversation with someone that actually would want to talk toyou and ultimate buy your product. It just fundamentally makes sense totally. It'sso good that someone's tackling that problem again for both sides of the for bothpeople on both sides of an opportunity. So let's talk sales development in generaland str role in particular, especially for people who aren't familiar with the dayto day in these seats and in these teams. I guess we'll let's startwith your definition or guiding philosophy of that role, like what is how doesit fit into what we're doing as organizations? And it's interesting, as I mentionedearlier, you know, we talk about the three layers between you knowand image contributors, managers and executives. A lot of people fundamentally kind ofstruggle with what the role actually doesn't have to do it well, at itscore, the most important thing to remember is strb our teams are providing valueto people. If you're doing it right, your jobs focus is making sure thatyou have a strong understanding of a company, what they care about,how to aligns your product and being able to provide value to them. So, you know, when you think about...

...traditional Strbr tems, people think ofjust like hammering the phone and and batching blast emails and annoying linkedin messages andyes, that that is a way to reach out to someone, but thereality is, you know, when you think of high functioning sturb our teams, it's the teams that use those mediums to ultimately give something that's going tohelp someone do their job better. That's that's the mantra that we have moreso focus on, and we've noticed that when you have a strong ability tonot only focus on that but find different avenues to pursue that, whether it'sthrough intend data or having a strong understanding of certain personas and why they wantto buy your product, and can not only make your team highly functioning butalso kind of set the setup for how other BDR team should be across theindustry. Yeah, I have a just gave me a glimpse into like areally promising future where people are more satisfied D in their work and they're engagingwith people in ways that satisfy them. Were as well. So you camein as a director, your senior director today, on the way in thedoor, what were a couple things that you kind of looked at or evaluatedto say oh good, this is on track, or this is an opportunityto, you know, do things a little bit better. What were acouple things you did kind of on the way in that are fruitful for youtoday? Yeah, sure. So, you know, whenever taking look atan strb are tow there a lot of different albums to pursue. I've probablysay the most important to kind of take a look at his one year process, but also, you know, not to mention the messaging. So whenI first came on to sixth cents, that was probably the biggest thing thatI focused on, again going back to how you're treating your customers, andeventual customers could say you want to make sure that you're giving them something.So the first thing that I focused it on was, like what are wesaying to our customers, like why are that what gets them to take likewhat's the main reason why I should buy sixth sense, and how can Ilie that to our content we have on our website, to what our teamis creating, to what gets people to help and help them self effectively?And that's the biggest thing that I focused on. In a lot of resourcesout there, from the sales law off through outreach of like how to structurethese messages through different chap different channels, but if you do it right andyou're focuseded across the board and is giving to your prospects and giving your eventof customers. But I can see a lot of good chains and some goodresults out of that. Nice. I also heard in your response to theobvious call for sales and marketing alignment, which we won't spend a lot oftime on because it's a you know, it's one of those it was oneof those topics everyone likes to talk about because it's necessary, but I thinkit's better done than talked about and it sounds like just even that process ofthat evaluation begs for it. So again, generally for the ignorant among us,what is success look like in the roll? Besides the obvious, likebook meetings, Appointments Booked and appointments held, like what are what are some whetherit's metrics or whether it's kind of other outcomes related to the process ofengaging buyers and bringing them along and serving them? What a success look likein the role? Yeah, sure, and again it's not as simple asjust meetings, you know, like you do have to make sure that you'regoing after the right accounts. They're going after council. That, I shoulddo turns opportunities and there are a lot of different mestrics that we take alook at it in the term of the overall volume, and one thing wehave really trying to pay attention to is, yes, volume is good because it'sa good indicator of where you're going to go, but it should necessarilyto find you. And if you create numbers to define whether or not,I'm sorry, numbers in terms without activity, in terms of whether or not soas successful, then that's you create a cultural people is pushing out content, pushing out calls just for a take of hitting a number, and they'renot focusing their buyers. So we try and create environment where we're tracking tosee like basically baselines around what it means to be successful within the role,how many meetings can be generated, as well as how many minis can beturned to qualified opportunities, because it's not enough to just have a conversation withsomeone because you want to and you want to talk about your brand and whatyou're doing. Get to really make sure that we are people that actually wantto talk to you and they're they're actually wanted to education of products. Okay, I appreciate the stab there. Something I call activity worship, and youknow it's just like it's like flipping things around a little bit. I meantheir tools there means two ends rather than ends and in themselves, and soit always appreciate someone who kind of takes...

...a moment to kind of punch thatdown a little bit. One aspect of you're about that I didn't read.You listed some of the channels that you help sellers connect and communicate through.Just give a rundown on those. What are some of the preferred channels?How or maybe they trending to your observation? You've been obviously in you know,in this space for several years and I'm sure some things are trending upand trending down. Specifically, of course, I'm interested in video. So sharewhatever you hear, whatever you'd like about the different kind of modes ofconnecting and communicating. Yeah, sure it. You know, sales development is reallyinteresting because like the way it is right now is going to be completelydifferent six months from now and six months from them. So you do haveto be very much in the know of how things are developing now. There'ssome cores that tend to work really well and like I think they're kind oftrying through and not really going where you're time soon. One. Obviously everyonedoesn't email, I think you but is important more than anything not to justdo one channel, have a true multi channels stragy. So email is stillreally effective. One thing that people will kind of shy away from, butI think it is not because it's in effective, more people because they justdon't want to actually do it. It's calling. Calling is still super powerful. Even if you don't actually get a conversation station with someone, it isa way to at least like leave a voicemail and then kind of has somekind of grant familiarity. Social is the one that I'll say is definitely onthe rise as of lately. I'd say social has game even more problems becauseof covid you know the fact that everyone's at home trying to find different voiceto come to connect with each other. Overall, linkedin activity has increased justbecause of how this environment is are now and to your point, video isstill very powerful and we have very specific ways that we track video and tomake sure whether it's effective and kind of how we're able to come work theminto opportunities, and it's somebody that's only going to continue to get better becausepeople starting to realize more and more every day that like it is an awesomeway to add your striving to get in more opportunities. Awesome. I oneof the things I like that you raised about the phone there is I feellike it's kind of like direct mail was for a different reason, like youknow, everyone was doing it and then people pulled back from it because theRoi was not as obvious, and so now it's like, oh, there'sjust more capacity for it, for receiving this, and I think to yourpoint, a lot of humans don't like picking up the phone. As justtalking with a Gal who jump joined our marketing team at from the BDR positioninside our company, and one thing she shared with me is that, andso I'm curious to know if you've experimented with this see yourself or your teammembers have. Is oftentimes on voicemail. She wouldn't even leave her number,she would just use it as this opportunity to communicate something in particular and thenreference and other touch point, whether it was a personal video that she hadsent by email or by Linkedin or some other touch point, and so it'slike you know, she was. It was interesting to me, again,as someone you know, fully a step outside this kind of role in thedetails of it, to hear the idea of using the phone not to generatea call back but instead to kind of connect it to the other pieces exactly. And that's that's more. That's the person we take because you know thereality is if you call a hundred people, you might catch three to four,maybe five maximum with a live conversation, but you have the opportunity of allthose voicemails and if you even affective voicemail, those people will go inyour linkedin page. We're going look your emails, overlook your videos. Sowe take the voicemail as a way to kind of make sure that in thereality is because you know, different prospects respond to different avenues. So ifyou live a voicemail, that person might just be the person who doesn't respondto thought. That's just kind of who they are. But they get thatvoice mode and whatever avenue they care more about or their most most recently goingtowards, they will see your message and it's a good way for them tokind of be reminded to reach back out to you. Love it are againfor the ignorant here, me and certain least some of our listeners. Youknow, it's really obviously, really important to identify the channel that people you'reconnecting, communicating with prefer. Is there anything going on in the back end, in any of the systems that you're using that help your team members knowyou know this guy or this Gal has not engaged in these in these channels, they happen to respond in this other...

...one. Focus with this person,focus on this channel, or is it something that you're really leaving, froma strategy position and identity identification position, to each individual to figure out forher himself? Yeah, so I do think it's really important to kind ofleave it to the individual figure out. But the biggest thing that we're focusedon is the engagement behind it. So if you're reaching out and someone reallinkedin and you can see they read your message or they're visiting your profile andthere's a pretty good chance that person to have some linkedin and just keep goingdown that channel, if you're seeing that you're leaving someone a voicemail and they'regoing back and open your emails. After at the voicemail, then just keephanging on the phone because there's a chance you might be able to get themthrough the same thing with someone through the email or through video. They're alwaysviewing your videos. They will respond. Just keep pushing forward, making sureyou're obviously providing value to them, so it's not just some kind of redundant, stale message. But we tend to look at the at the engagement,as a way of whether or not I keep pushing this channel, because they'reat least engaging with some of the content. There's a pretty high likelihood that they'llrespond in a given pure of time. Sure, so a lot of peoplesee this as kind of an entry level roll and it is in alot of cases. What are a couple qualities you look for in someone andmaybe what tips might you offer for people? This would apply certainly beyond the bedrstrrole, as so many people are hiring new team members at positions ofall levels and they're doing it virtually. You don't get that kind of benefitof being, you know, sidebyside and kind of like the Camaraderie and someonelike the culture build up and stuff, and we'll get into culture in aminute, but any tips for hiring new team members, in in particular hiringan onboarding and training and ramping, you know, when you can't spend timephysically together. Yeah, sure, so I will say probably the most thetwo most important things of running effective strbdr team is effectively recruiting as well ason boarding. Like if you if you can hit a home run with thosetwo things in your job is so easy. That being said, in terms ofthe person that you want to bring on board, so in this isactually pulled from one of the sales leaders are sales off which we kind ofbaked into our process, you want to find people that are naturally curious.Curious people are always asking why they're we're trying to figure out like different waysto hack the system and expertise learning. We're always looking for that. JustNatural Grit. You know, sales can be a challenging job and the personis going to keep pushing forward is really important. Do you want to makesure that we have it's called general mental ability, and the way I basicallykind of coin that is, can I hire someone who can connect the dotsbetween this piece of personalized information, the company's value PROPA and make it relevantto our product. And from what I've seen in the past from, youknow, beat our teams, I've let, I've run, that is probably themost challenging thing to try and assess throughout the tergy process. But ifyou can do it really well, then you're going to hire people. It'srelatively easy figure out who's going to work really hard, who's naturally curious,who was a growth mindset, as in their coachable but that that genera mentalability is a tricky one. But if you can kind of pull up thoseother three or four strong qualities and really do a good job assessing from thegeneral mental ability, you're going to hire some really strong people. And thenin terms of the onboarding the most important thing that I think with that isthe industry specific information. A lot of people tend to lead with like overallPRODC knowledge, which is great as an SDR bed are, but the realityis, like I'm not going to give full fledged to our demos. Iknow more or less of what my customers pain points are by persona and whyshould buy our products and I can communicate to them via phone, the email, video, whatever may be. So we tend to focus a lot onlike understanding the industry, the basic fundamentals around each channel, on how tohow to do our best practices, and then kind of let the the restfor the rest speaker itself. But also one thing too, and you'd mentionthis, is we also baken culture into our onboarding, because this is somethingI've learned specifically from my time as a personal athlete. You have to likenot only bake it in but constantly reinforce it to make sure that when thingsare not going well or where things are going well, people know why it'sgoing in that way and your culture is always a definition behind that. Reallygood. So we'll get deeper into that...

...here. So we get into yourthree C's and I guess, just to keep people super engage, as Ido, an overly long set up here, probably career, culture and compensation.So creating alignment between those and so and how we'll get here is youwere mentioning a really great built in article that was titled Sales Leaders Are SettingSdrs up for failure. Dot Dot dot. They shouldn't. I don't know thatwe needed that. That dot dot part totally drew. I'm with you, and it started with a great quote from Nikki Ivy, which was,you know, there there are times when an str is made to feel likethey're being told to shut up and dial which is an interest and interesting referenceto think a Lebron James Scenario where they're trying to just, you know,get people that hey, stop, stop talking about your whole life stock,stop talking about being a real whole person, stop talking about things you care about, just do the activity. It also refers to SDRs, one oftext most misunderstood in grueling entry level roles, and, of course it highlights yourthcs, career culture and compensation, which is why I reached out inthe first place. Thanks a good for joining me. So let's start withmisunderstood and grueling. I don't know if you remember that line, but wouldyou agree with that? Most definitely. You know, it's funny that youknow this Rbr role is an entry level role. It is like it's thefirst step into whatever your current pathbate might be in a lot of different techcompanies, but the reality is with how it's developed over period of time andhow it's evolved like it is not an entry level role, like the levelsophistication that you need to get meetings with fortune, one hundred companies with thesea look some the people in your company needs to have a conversation with.Is Getting even more difficult because the market is so saturated with different strbd ourteams that only the strong who have a keen ability to really understand personas understandpanpoints. Even at times digging into K's and Google News and all these differentresources in ways almost set like working as mini consultants. Yes, it isan entry level role, but the work you're doing is not entry level andthe reality is, yes, part of being an SDR BEDR is growing attimes, you know, because you are calling people and sometimes people just theylove just take out their aggression on STRs bedrs. You see it all thetime of Linkedin. Someone gets a bad emailed from someone and they just takeus an opportunity to shout out and SCR BEDR who was just trying to dohis her job. They maybe didn't have a good effort with it, butthat's kind of the mindset and kind of how strs and beds are treated andit is tough. It's really unfortunate. But I will say with with howthe industry involving especially around the sophistication needed to be effective. I'm optimistic thatthat will change in the bdrs and stairs will start getting a little more respect, because they definitely deserve it. Totally agree in that many consultant language youused really connected with me because it ties together some of what you're talking aboutin your previous response, which is, like, generically speaking, kind ofbusiness acumen blended with Persona and industry knowledge. And there is a consultancy role toplay here, which is I'm talking with, you know, people inyour role and in your industry every day, all day, and I would liketo share some of what I've learned by serving the scene and getting intoconversation with you, and so I completely see that and agree. So walkus through your three C's. What did you do? Obviously I love frameworks, I love things that are easy to remember, but how did you arriveat this and just walk us through them? Yeah, sure. So the threeseas, as mentioned, our career, culture and compensation. I think oneof the cool things about my place in a leadership role is I wasa BEDR before and I've seen and spoken to a lot of different drs.I know kind of what gets people to take also knowing what gets people tobe motivated. And the reality is every BDR needs someone to work for thathas a true and this is not just for videos, for a lot ofdifferent people, but sdrsbdrs need to have someone's truly invested in their career soyou know as an SDR, be are leader or real to you. Ifthe bed are support of marketing, you don't necessarily know kind of the introducesees of the other role. There has to be a system set up inplace, whether it's, you know,...

...the course or a year, twoyears, whatever may be, where there's some kind of path for for thebdrs and SDRs like it is too hard of a job and there's too muchof rejection on a constant basis to not have a north star guide, UniteDirection. So every SDR BDR team needs to have that career aspect. Compensationis a no brainer. You know you're working really hard. You want tomake sure that the efforts of what you're doing, what you're doing are seen, and so having a clear cut composition plan that's aligned with, obviously thebusiness goals, but make sure that your team is taking care of is reallyimportant. So talk about career Taco conversation. Now last talk about culture, andthis is definitely pulled from my time as a professional athlete, but theculture is kind of what makes it breaks a team, because if you havea team that's grueling and working really hard and there's not that there's in amechanism place to make sure that people are taking care of each other or takingcare of as a whole, can be really challenging and our way at sixthsense of making sure that we are addressing the culture is we had this companyacronym of Family, and family stands for fun, accountability, Mindfulness, integrity, love and yes, and every single week during every forecasting call with mybeady our team, we highlight two people per region and have them spit offlike what do they see from other people in the more of a shadow session, what people from the team did they see who are embodying that family culture, that that person have a yes mentality, meaning that you know there's just onecadence or one sequence that had to be done and though it wasn't somethingthat was going to be within their job scope, they did it because itmeant the for the better good of the overall team. With an incountable inthe fact that we had to have this account structure put in place and everyonehad to do it for the team be overall effective. They had our number. So every single aspect of that, of that acronym, is something thatwe all try to live for and also not to mention. The reality islike, though, we do promote it. If someone isn't embodying that, thenwe do address it as well, because, you know, having thatstrong culture is important and it kind of gets you through everything as you gothrough. So so good. I love the acronym that it spells family.I mean there's certainly some debate about are we family members or team members orboth? Can't we be both? I so appreciate that. Love is inthere. It's one of those things that that I don't think, you know, it's something we all need in want and I and I think it's somethingthat is often left on the sideline because it's not sufficiently professional or it's notreally quantifiable. It's like to you know, it's really, really good. Ireally like that. The other thing I want to highlight here is howsmart the approach is, because you reference to early here in the conversation thisidea of not just saying the culture or trying to capture it in words,but actually sustaining it over time, not just on boarding to it, butmaking sure it's a living, breathing aspect of the organization every day. Andso this idea of giving it to team members in order to prop each otherup on different aspects of it is really, really smart. We do a versionof that ourselves around our five core values, but I really appreciate thatyou're doing it within your team. Something you said in that in that passagethere that would make me cares. How big is the team and how isit you know, I think you mentioned regions. How like just describe brieflyyour team structure? Yeah, sure, so right now roughly about twenty ofus on the East Coast and West Coast. So team in New York, teamin San Frantistco, though, I will say through Covid or kind ofall is right now. But again, really important for the culture because weintentionally have it where if you're on the east coast, you're showing someone onthe West Coast, if you're in the west coast are showing to some inthe east coast, and that's just our way of basically making sure that ourteam is staying connected through everything. Really good. Give me one layer deeperon compensation really quickly. Maybe. What are some common errors that you've seenyour peers and other organizations doing with regard our decompensation? Or maybe an insightwhether it's something you developed or or implemented yourself, or again, whether it'sa no you're engaged with the SDR community, maybe it's something you learn from someoneelse. What what's maybe a misunderstanding...

...or a misstep with regard to compensation? Maybe a trend or something cool or interesting or useful that that has beenreally helpful. Yeah, sure, so. compet like Bedr sc our conversation,is something that people really struggle with and I've done a million different iterationsof this and the one that I feel the most confident of I've been usingpretty consistently for the past two years, is having a blended approach of compassingthe team for esals or se accepted leads or basically a qualified opportunity, ofStage one opportunity as well as an s q of more a sales qualified opportunity. And I've noticed if you caught your team primarily on meetings, then thequality of opportunities aren't very strong. If you cought your team only on qualifiedopportunities, sometimes there's not very much that the SCR b DRS can do afterthat initial meeting to push it to qualified opportunity. So having an approach whereyou're mainly compensating the team for generating strong meetings that go well, but alsowholely am accountable for those opportunities at a certain degree and make sure they progressforward is really important and you know, for the time that I've been doingthis one, if I guess the past two years or so, I've hada lot of success with it and I think a lot of people should thinkif you're your kind of thinking about how to properly do your team's compensation plan, take a look at whether or not your compensate only for one of theother and trying to find a way to blend it will not only make surethat your team is going in the right direction, but the overall quality ofyour plotefoint to be strong, really smart. I really appreciate that blend of qualityand quantity and figuring out a way to blend them together so that itworks. I kind of tease up, you know. Sometimes I'll ask questionsin a variety of ways, but they all have this what do you wishmore of this person knew about this role or function? So I got acouple of those for you and one of them kind of goes to where youjust were, which is what do you wish more account executives newer understood aboutsales development or the SDR roll. Yeah, it's really interestingly you ask that,because a lot of accountings that coultive worse star videos totally. And thenwhich kind of goes to which goes to your career? See a little bit. I mean that. I think a lot of people see that as anatural progression maybe, but but I've also talked with the number of SDRs.They're like, yeah, I don't really want to do that, I'm justnot quite sure what I want to do. And so they want to be youearnest. They want that exactly how a team of people. So Idid. Sorry. Yeah, you're right and we know. The biggest thingthat I'd kind of caution a kind of executives to do is to is toknow that maybe the strategy that you did is this drb are or what worksfor you. It's necessarily the end I'll be all. I like to hireand work with SDRs of readers are really dynamic, and then I want tolike I want them to take the handcuffs off and basically kind of run freeand test and try to find new ways to learn. And when you kindof Pigeonhole your SDR Bedr because you have a certain way of doing things thatdon't allow them him or her to to kind of exercise their creativity and kindof grow in their own capacity. I think it's a big mistake that alot of a's do really, really good observation. Even that ties back tosomething you said before, which is the way it's being done now is differentthan the way it was being done six months ago and should be different sixmonths from now as well. And so you think about an a that's maybebeen doing it for a year or two and they're really removed from that process. It's some layer in the market is moving very quickly for variety of reasons, some of which you've already hit on. What do you wish more marketers newor understood about str or the sales development role? Yeah, that's agreat question. I think that a lot of marketers look at the stir videorole as a lot more like like just pure numbers of like push out xamount of sequences, make x amount of dials, and the reality is likein marketing, there a lot of different systems of place that rely on onmetric. So it makes sense to kind of think of that way at times, but I wish that marketers knew how dynamic strs and betrs had to bein order generated meeting, because it's not quite as a black at black aswhite as a just using a template or using a sequencerkidence that you think workswell right, which brings me back to video a little bit. I'd loveto know when, how much is your team using video and because, like, the reason that just came back to...

...mind was one I like to goa little bit deeper on it. But then too, it isn't just sequenceis it is about some of these kind of subtleties and nuances and even someimmeasurables that make someone really, really good in the role. And so whendid you kind of get turned onto video? How did you view it it?Were you one of these people that are like this seems like a gimmick, or where you're like, Oh, this let's my people be people oryou know, what's your view of it and I maybe how is your teamembraced it or not embraced it? Yeah, it's great question. So I thinkI first, I mean I think I first started like getting interested invideo right when I was leaving the SDR video role becoming a e and Ithink it was kind of fairly early on ro a lot of companies weren't reallyusing it. It wasn't baked into my process, but it was something thatat least explored. My first thing I built out, we actually did usevideo and I think there are right ways to do it and when you doit the right way and you understand the goals associated with that, what you'retrying to get out the video, then you can do really well with it, and also for us. But we have a metric on it, likeI want to make sure that a team is any x videos per week,per month, because we know it's a really strong touch point that can driveconversations and you know, you always hear and say it where you know ifan organization gets a really strong video, really creative video from Dr bed arekind of just goes viral and the organization totally and especially if you think abouttaking an account based approach. That's how you do account based selling. Likeif I can have an SDR BEDR do a really creative video, it's thepoint where, like, someone laughs or soon get some kind of enjoyment outof see the true value in it and it gets shared. Problem solved.Everyone the company knows about six sens and I think people forget that when theyuse video because at times when you when you use video like, people mightsay, well, I want to know, I want to get the email responseright away. I was in one video going to get a meeting rightoff of the Bat. But the reality is, like, guess it doeshappen. Does happen frequently, but it's not just about that first meeting asabout taking the video and seeing how many clicks, how many clicks came fromthat, because if it's getting clicks a lot and shared a lot, theyreally are incorporating a true account based model. Wherever in your organization is seeing andthat's kind of what we measure our team up. So we have themetric of making sure you're doing videos on a weekly basis, both in thosevideos. Yes, we do want to see some beings coming through with that. But you also want to see like, are you getting a lot of opensand clicks, because we know that Hick sales offt it. Some kindof study on this is kind of like what I preached to my team,but we do know that if you do incorporate video that they increase your responserace by like twenty six percent, and the reason why we say that isit is not just off that first touch email, but it allows you totake a true account based approach where you have a lot of strong familiarity withyour facing your brand, where pep a lot more receptive to responding back toyou. Right, I have that vision to I'm looking my vision for tosomeone who's helping people do this every single day and encouraging people to do itall this is that it stops being a thing like no one, no onemakes a big deal out of an email or linked to can actually request ora voice mail. I mean a lot of people don't like to do themand there's certainly ways to do them better and different ways to time them andplace them, but my hope is the video just becomes part of the mixand it in it is the one that is the most of the whole personsso that I can associate your voice mail and your email with something a bitmore human and hopefully fun and interesting. And so when you say creative,by the way, I want to I want to really emphasize this, becausepeople that are on the sidelines with video right now, I think they heara word like really creative video and they think, well, I don't havetime for creativity, or I don't have the budget for creativity or out havethe equipment for creativity. But I have heard a number of creative ideas thatcost really nothing and frankly, so many of them I've seen get sales repsand other people really excited because it just makes their job a little bit morefun. Like they have the site this slightly creative idea. They didn't askfor, you know, one thousand eight hundred bucks to executed or eighteen grandto execute it. They just like, Oh, I know what would befun to do or interesting to do or...

...what might work. So give aquick pass on creative to knock down any of the myths around it. Yeah, sure thing, and I think with creativity that you can go a lotdifferent direct cause you could be a short and sweet we're going to take themore involved, an involved but more the approach. We're doing a lot moreresearch and try to figure out different ways get in there. I've seen someawesome creative videos where this one str basically did a freestyle to a Hamilton Songon a piano to a company and went viral. Up The organization for theflip side. Creativity could be as simple as you see people using that theboard, the white boards. It can be as simple as you know.I think it's full Lito. I forget the website is so basically showing anews article with the person's name on and I'm in a fun headline. Sothere are a lot of ways to scale creativity and I think people kind offorget that. But as long as you have like your own voice and yourown brand and kind of your own way of doing things, it could bepretty easy to do so. And but I do think it is really importantto have creativity in your video because it does allow to stick out. Yeah, I like it in and I just want to reinforce to something you saidearlier, which is it the why and the how behind video. Is isa lot, is a lot of it. If you understand why you're doing itand you have some basic guidance on how to do it, it'll ina lot of ways take care of itself and it's just another nice, richer, more complete touch point than some of the other ones that were offering.So I guess kind of last question here before I tee you up for twoof my favorite questions. I guess it's kind of three. I pair acouple of them together. But what is unique about the defensive end position?Yeah, sure, so the defensive end in my eyes, probably the mostathletic positions on the DEVENSI ON DEC s out of ball, because you're goingagainst people that are like kids, are not like six eight, three hundredand fifty pounds, like like an actual the definition of a giant right hereright really go like an actual giant. Yeah, but the same time youalso have to do certain ethlic performance that you're running with or competing with someof the most athletic people in the game. So it's a pure combination of strengthand speed. But the thing that I love the most about the positionis highly technical. Like if you're a great defensive end and to get tothe NFL Kut us over to what I did, is you really only haveto hone in on one skill set that's your strength and just rinse and repeatedand make a stronger and stronger throughout time. So it's a weird position where it'sprobably one of the most athletic on the field but also one of themost technical. So it's you don't really see that very often in terms ofthat combination. But I will say that understanding of the position helped me aton as a transition to sales. Excellent I did, and that's why Idid that qualifier off the top of sports analogies and metaphors in terms of phrase, because they're just everywhere and I didn't want to do that, but Iknew there was something there for you just to it just in the way thatyou talked about it. So if you have enjoyed this conversation so far withearnest, and there is more to come, I've got two more that I knowyou'll also enjoy. Episode Seventy one of the customer experience podcast, andthat was with Ed Brialt, the CMO at a premo. He is aCMO that has a bdrsdr reporting to him and we talked a lot of videoin the theme of that one was differentiating your brand by humanizing the experience.So that was episode seventy one with Ed Brialt of a Primo, and then, or a little bit earlier on, episode fifty one, with Joe Caprio. At the time, use VP sales at chorus and he's currently a cofounderat Repris and we call that what how to enable your sales team. Practicaltips for sales leaders. Earnest, got a few things for you here,and first up is the opportunity for you to think or mention someone who's hada positive impact on your life for your career. Yeah, sure so.If I think about this, this whole tech game I started playing after Ifinished playing football, the one person who really made a big impact on me, and actually never even really worked with him as his guide, Chris Casteldini. So when I was eventually moving on to going from the count executive toan a bed our manager, I a...

...lot of times beat our managers.When you first do it, you're honestly not really reporting to the bed.Our manager got to build the build the players are flying. So I hadreached out to a lot of people trying to like figure out what to doand I've reached out to him and he gave me so much information that I'vekind of, you know, went to what's the bank with but also evenin that, I remember he did a Linkedin Post where he just talked aboutour conversation and like really made me feel good because he was saying, likethis is a guy who did this, this and this, like he approachedme and he tried to learn and watch out for earnest. He's going tobe one of the great strbd our leaders in the future, and it wasreally cool to get that, especially because I honestly had no idea what Iwas doing at a time and just seeing someone who didn't really know me,who really believed in me, was something that, you know, I alwayscherish. That's so good and I just assume you approached him from an honestand curious and sincere position, asked for a little bit of help. Andit's so funny. I would assume that the work ethic required to play professionalfootball, as well as kind of the great you were talking about earlier inthe BDR role is, you know, it lends itself to to asking andI think so, so many people that don't have those kind of qualities,miss opportunities to learn and grow and connect because they're a little bit afraid toask maybe. So that was awesome. And what was he doing at thetime, like, what was his role? Why did you choose or reach outto him? Sure, so he was leading the SCARBR team and optimizedly. He's now transitioned on too FREGEO. What companies that right now? Buthe's now actually selling them the enterprise side. And the reason I reach out tohim is because I knew that he knew his stuff. Like he inthe industry who was sold that people always talked about. He had a verylarge team and I knew I had a lot to learn from him. Andto your point, yeah, I'm never hesitant to reach out to ask someonefor help. Like, more time than not, all of us, whetherwe want to believe it or not, we don't have to reinvent the wheel. We don't have to do it, and a lot of the challenges andoptions that we're going to face have been done by others. So it's alwaysin our best interest to try and reach out to people that have done itreally well, and he was one of them. So that's just why Ireach out to him really good. How about earnest, a company or abrand that you appreciate or respect for the experience they deliver for you as acustomer? Yeah, sure, so one that I've been a customer with themfor three, going on four years now, is a company called Se Academy andSecunties, essentially an organization that helps find individuals from under uptented backgrounds andhelp some land rolls and str roles. So I first started working with them, I'd say it was the spring of two thousand and seven teen, whereI did a lot of mentoring, kind of helping people prepare for interviews,teaching the tacks around how to be in effective as to our bed are,and I love everything they stand for. So working with an organization that,you know, really hits home to me with a lot of my values,and that's some of the peoples think about with, you know, customer experienceas something that I always share such because I know they are fighting a fightthat I, you know, truly care about. Nice, if someone wantsto check them out, where should they go? Yeps, the ACADEMYCOM orjust reach out to me. I'll be more having a connection. Awesome earnest. If that leads. We did by final question, which is someone wantsto connect with you. They obviously, if they're listening at this point,they found it interesting, helpful and engaging. And so if someone wants to connectwith you or they want to learn more about six cents, like orSB Academy where you send people, sure. So I'll talk about me first.If you want to reach out to me, my two meames are onelinkedin. That's probably our most active. So linkedin upcom Ernest Ousu, andthen on on on twitter as another one, and surprisingly there are a lot ofearnest to Musu's. You think it's a not common able to. Actuallyis pretty common. So my twitter handle is the earnest to Woosu. Interms of trying to figure out whether or not you want to have a conversationwith six cents or one more, we do definitely go on to a website. We actually have this thing where we called in marketing man report. Soif you're interested in learning more about the companies that are researching your brand nameor even your competitors, that's a really quick form to fill out to geta sense of what that information looks like. Once you fill it in, willdo the analysis for you and then basically pass over to using so youcan learn more about that. So going to a website and fill the inmarketing a report. It's really custom report.

That should help you and also lastedat least with seacavity. Just going seccom and filled a form and they'llbe real. They'll be sure to reach out to you. Awesome. Ilove that opportunity on your website. It's so just classic, wonderful, completeblend of leading with value. That also demonstrates your expertise. So well done, earnest. I appreciate this so much. Appreciate your times. Really Fun.Thank you. Awesome that. Having clear communication, human connection, higherconversion, these are just some of the benefits of adding video to the messagesyou're sending every day. It's easy to do with just a little guidance,so pick up the official book rehumanize Your Business. How personal videos accelerate salesand improve customer experience. Learn more in order today at Bombombcom Book. That'sbomb bombcom book. Thanks for listening to the customer experience podcast. Remember,the single most important thing you can do today is to create and deliver abetter experience for your customers continue learning the latest strategies and tactics by subscribing rightnow in your favorite podcast player, or visit Bombombcom podcast.

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